Another FOI regrading sickness at RM

[TrueBlueTerrier]

WhatDoTheyKnow
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This is an HTML version of an attachment to the Freedom of Information request 'How managers are suppose to manage sickness and absence'.




16th January 2012

Emilia Onwuama
Information Rights Team
5 Old Bridge Close
(Freedom of Information Act)

Company Secretary’s Office

4th Floor

Royal Mail Sheffield

Pond Street
Copy by Email:
SHEFFIELD
[email address]
S98 6HR
[FOI #97044 email]

[Royal Mail Group request email]
http://www.royalmail.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Dear Miss Onwuama

Re: Freedom of Information Act Request (Our Reference: DTUP-8PJE7B)

I am writing in response to your recent request for information received by email on 14th
December 2011 and by post on the 21st December 2011. Your request has been
considered under the terms of the Freedom of Information Act 2000. In your emails and
letter you requested the following information relating to management procedures for
sickness and absence. I will answer your questions in the order they appeared.

“I would be grateful if you could provide the procedure management are required
to follow in respect of the following;”

1. Keeping in contact with employee:

Royal Mail Group has a contact strategy with employees who are off sick from work. On the
first day of an absence the employee must contact their line manager, If the employee
cannot speak directly to their manager (and therefore has to leave a message), they must
leave their contact details so that the manager can ring them back during the employee’s
shift or working day in order to find out how the employee is, and discuss the likely length
of absence. They will also discuss what support, if appropriate, can be offered to help the
employee back to work and agree the level and nature of contact during the first week of
absence. Regular contact should be maintained if the absence goes beyond seven days.

2. Management interview requests and established guidelines for these interviews.

The business makes the following guidelines available in relation to management
interviews:

If the employee is away from work for more than two weeks, and either the manager or the
employee feels this would be helpful, the employee can request, or the manager will invite,
the employee to attend a meeting which would normal y take place at work or, if this is
inappropriate, at the employee's home if they so wish.

The purpose of the discussion will be to allow the employee and manager to contribute to
the return to work plan - help to identify barriers to their return to work and the options
available.

3. How management should approach an employee who has been diagnosed with a
mental health condition:

Where an employee is suffering with a mental health condition, the management team
should refer the employee to ATOS Healthcare, our occupational health provider as soon as
possible, preferably on day one of the absence. Royal Mail Group also provides support in
the form of the ‘HELP’ advisory service a confidential and independent helpline.

4. If management have any authority to any time disregard medical opinion of
employee’s GP or occupational health adviser?

The line manager is responsible for the workplace, his team, and their health & safety.
Although GP’s and ATOS Healthcare provide important advice to support the decision
making process, the line manager is the person who makes the final decision when
managing sick absence cases.

5. Who within Royal Mail is responsible for ensuring all procedures and guidelines in
respect of the above are adhered to?

The line management team within each area manage the Royal Mail Group absence and
attendance procedures. Where an individual feels that their direct line manager is treating
them unfairly, they can raise the issue either informally, or formal y as a grievance, with
their second line manager. The second line manager has an obligation to investigate the
issues raised and, where appropriate, take corrective action.

If for any reason you are not satisfied with this response, you do have the right to request
a review. If you wish to do so please set out in writing your grounds of appeal and send to
the Head of Information Compliance, Royal Mail Group, Company Secretary's Office, 100
Victoria Embankment, LONDON, EC4Y 0HQ. An internal panel will then review the request,
and you will be advised of the outcome.

If you decide to appeal and are still not satisfied with our response you also have a right to
appeal to the Information Commissioner at:


Information Commissioner’s Office
Wycliffe House
Water Lane
Wilmslow
Cheshire
SK9 5AF
Telephone: 01625 545 700
http://www.informationcommissioner.gov.uk" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yours Sincerely



Daniel Tulp
Information Rights Officer
Company Secretary’s Office

[TrueBlueTerrier]

http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/9 ... B.pdf.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[POSTMAN]

2. Management interview requests and established guidelines for these interviews.

The business makes the following guidelines available in relation to management
interviews:

If the employee is away from work for more than two weeks, and either the manager or the
employee feels this would be helpful, the employee can request, or the manager will invite,
the employee to attend a meeting which would normal y take place at work or, if this is
inappropriate, at the employee's home if they so wish.

The purpose of the discussion will be to allow the employee and manager to contribute to
the return to work plan - help to identify barriers to their return to work and the options
available.

Employee health services are managed by an external provider on behalf of Royal Mail.

http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... =1&t=35771" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
So....................which one is it RM?

[POSTMAN]

4. If management have any authority to any time disregard medical opinion of
employee’s GP or occupational health adviser?

The line manager is responsible for the workplace, his team, and their health & safety.
Although GP’s and ATOS Healthcare provide important advice to support the decision
making process, the line manager is the person who makes the final decision when
managing sick absence cases.

This is really really bad!
Which makes nonsense of my link,in fact the whole thing is f***ing nonsense.

[fishtank]

4. If management have any authority to any time disregard medical opinion of
employee’s GP or occupational health adviser?

The line manager is responsible for the workplace, his team, and their health & safety.
Although GP’s and ATOS Healthcare provide important advice to support the decision
making process, the line manager is the person who makes the final decision when
managing sick absence cases.

This is really really bad!
Which makes nonsense of my link,in fact the whole thing is f***ing nonsense.

It's a shocking admission even though we're well aware of it.
I'm really surprised they've put it in writing.
The union should be all over this.

[fishtank]

5. Who within Royal Mail is responsible for ensuring all procedures and guidelines in
respect of the above are adhered to?

The line management team within each area manage the Royal Mail Group absence and
attendance procedures. Where an individual feels that their direct line manager is treating
them unfairly, they can raise the issue either informally, or formal y as a grievance, with
their second line manager. The second line manager has an obligation to investigate the
issues raised and, where appropriate, take corrective action.

That doesn't even come close to answering the question.
The question was who in Royal Mail makes sure managers do their job properly?
If the answer is no-one...just say no-one.

[POSTMAN]

4. If management have any authority to any time disregard medical opinion of
employee’s GP or occupational health adviser?

The line manager is responsible for the workplace, his team, and their health & safety.
Although GP’s and ATOS Healthcare provide important advice to support the decision
making process, the line manager is the person who makes the final decision when
managing sick absence cases.

This is really really bad!
Which makes nonsense of my link,in fact the whole thing is f***ing nonsense.

It's a shocking admission even though we're well aware of it.
I'm really surprised they've put it in writing.
The union should be all over this.

They can't seem to make their mind up,or are they just really getting stuck in now...

2nd Sept 2011
In response to point four of your request, the line manager is responsible for the
workplace, his team and their health and safety. Advice from GP’s and Occupational Health
is highly important when making decisions regarding sick absence cases. Their advice
always informs the final decisions which are made by our management team.

http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/7 ... 020911.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[easter bunny]

Your totally right of course.

ATOS involvement and reports are considered 'guidelines' and the final decision is the DOMs etc.

Some cynics may say ATOS is only there to keep RM on the right side of Employment Law and other legal redress. If you explained to Joe Public that a Manager with no Medical qualifations has the final say on a Employee, rather than a qualified Doctor- they wouldnt believe you.

It is because the procedures are clear for everyone to understand according to numerous ETs , it is very hard to win one if the Company has followed the Sick Absence guidelines.

[dvbuk55]

Your totally right of course.

ATOS involvement and reports are considered 'guidelines' and the final decision is the DOMs etc.

Some cynics may say ATOS is only there to keep RM on the right side of Employment Law and other legal redress. If you explained to Joe Public that a Manager with no Medical qualifations has the final say on a Employee, rather than a qualified Doctor- they wouldnt believe you.

It is because the procedures are clear for everyone to understand according to numerous ETs , it is very hard to win one if the Company has followed the Sick Absence guidelines.

And that, presumably, would include the guidelines being crap. Who here hasn't had experience of a line manager, who could barely tie his shoelaces, in whose hands your health and welfare rests

[easter bunny]

Too be fair, I believe a lot of the old school Managers would accept a Medical report as concrete . However, there are a lot of another breed who wouldn't ( jumped up ex Postman come to mind ) ...

[General Mannerheim]

So somebody in either Data Protection or HR services or indeed Royal Mail HQ have never heard of the Pousson case against BT?.

BT's system automatically generated reports when thresholds were triggered and, in Mr Pousson's case, triggered a poor performance procedure. He received warnings on at least four occasions over a two year period for absences from his desk and for days off sick.

Mr Pousson was examined by Dr Almond of BT's Occupational Health Service. Her report showed that Mr Pousson had a history of difficulty in controlling his condition and in keeping his blood sugar within a stable range.

Dr Almond had noted that diabetes sufferers can be more prone to general viruses and infections and that these conditions can last longer or be more debilitating than in somebody without diabetes. She said that Mr Pousson's sickness absence would be likely to exceed a healthy colleague's because of his disability – and told BT that a reasonable adjustment under the Disability Discrimination Act would be to consider: an allowance for Mr Pousson's sickness absence; time off-line to test himself; access to food and drink at his place of work; or a different shift pattern to assist him in controlling his condition.

But BT ignored these recommendations, according to the Tribunal.

The company had tried to argue that Mr Pousson's absences had been unrelated to his diabetes; but the Tribunal found this "utterly untenable," given that BT had in Dr Almond's report "the clearest unequivocal medical advice" to the contrary.

The Tribunal said: "As soon as Dr Almond's report had been issued someone with the necessary authority, competence and understanding of disability should have taken over the management of this situation and issued the necessary advice and guidance to the managers."

I think ANY manager who tries it on with he knows better than occupational health, doctors etc better find himself a pretty good fake medical qualification certificate site or a good lawyer(not Weightmans they are shite!)

[Stormproof]

Shame there was no question asked about Stages & descretion. eg 'If an employee is injured in the process of doing their job would it go against them in the Attendence Procedure, ie being issued a Stage warning'.

[daveyeff]

4. If management have any authority to any time disregard medical opinion of
employee’s GP or occupational health adviser?

The line manager is responsible for the workplace, his team, and their health & safety.
Although GP’s and ATOS Healthcare provide important advice to support the decision
making process, the line manager is the person who makes the final decision when
managing sick absence cases.

This is really really bad!
Which makes nonsense of my link,in fact the whole thing is f***ing nonsense.

It's a shocking admission even though we're well aware of it.
I'm really surprised they've put it in writing.
The union should be all over this.

you would think a good solicitor/tribunal would crucify them on that admission

[POSTMAN]

4. If management have any authority to any time disregard medical opinion of
employee’s GP or occupational health adviser?

The line manager is responsible for the workplace, his team, and their health & safety.
Although GP’s and ATOS Healthcare provide important advice to support the decision
making process, the line manager is the person who makes the final decision when
managing sick absence cases.

This is really really bad!
Which makes nonsense of my link,in fact the whole thing is f***ing nonsense.

It's a shocking admission even though we're well aware of it.
I'm really surprised they've put it in writing.
The union should be all over this.

you would think a good solicitor/tribunal would crucify them on that admission

Thick as s**t RM,it's in the public domain!

[hantsman]

Your totally right of course.

ATOS involvement and reports are considered 'guidelines' and the final decision is the DOMs etc.

Some cynics may say ATOS is only there to keep RM on the right side of Employment Law and other legal redress. If you explained to Joe Public that a Manager with no Medical qualifations has the final say on a Employee, rather than a qualified Doctor- they wouldnt believe you.

It is because the procedures are clear for everyone to understand according to numerous ETs , it is very hard to win one if the Company has followed the Sick Absence guidelines.

Just because RM has writtern Sick procedures it does not follow that they are fair or reasonable or will be upheld by an ET if they have followed them.

If RM said jump out of a top floor window to get better would you follow that advice?