Management washing hands of responsibility

[Broxi51]

Our Dom has given us the responsibility on whether we go out on delivery or not.
He has also given us the responsibility to skip delivery points if we want.
I assume the reason for giving us that responsibility is because there is no corporate liability now and that if a
member of staff is injured then he can sue the manager if the postie feels that the manager hasnt taken
account of the conditions outwith the Delivery office.
I asked my rep what would happen if I said that the conditions weren't good for delivery. He said that
the Dom would have to find indoor work for me but obviously the weather has too be bad.
Why? If he has given ME the responsibility then surely my idea of bad weather has to be supported by my Dom
OR he must over ride my decision and send me out thereby taking full responsibility if anything happens.
I think I may like this scenario over the next few months

[hampshireman]

Our Dom has given us the responsibility on whether we go out on delivery or not.
He has also given us the responsibility to skip delivery points if we want.
I assume the reason for giving us that responsibility is because there is no corporate liability now and that if a
member of staff is injured then he can sue the manager if the postie feels that the manager hasnt taken
account of the conditions outwith the Delivery office.
I asked my rep what would happen if I said that the conditions weren't good for delivery. He said that
the Dom would have to find indoor work for me but obviously the weather has too be bad.
Why? If he has given ME the responsibility then surely my idea of bad weather has to be supported by my Dom
OR he must over ride my decision and send me out thereby taking full responsibility if anything happens.
I think I may like this scenario over the next few months

Surely the get out is that he has given you the responsibilty ; whether you go out ot not?If you then get injured , then the get out applies?

I could be wrong

[hampshireman]

Our Dom has given us the responsibility on whether we go out on delivery or not.
He has also given us the responsibility to skip delivery points if we want.
I assume the reason for giving us that responsibility is because there is no corporate liability now and that if a
member of staff is injured then he can sue the manager if the postie feels that the manager hasnt taken
account of the conditions outwith the Delivery office.
I asked my rep what would happen if I said that the conditions weren't good for delivery. He said that
the Dom would have to find indoor work for me but obviously the weather has too be bad.
Why? If he has given ME the responsibility then surely my idea of bad weather has to be supported by my Dom
OR he must over ride my decision and send me out thereby taking full responsibility if anything happens.
I think I may like this scenario over the next few months

Surely the get out is that he has given you the responsibilty ; whether you go out ot not?If you then get injured , then the get out applies?

I could be wrong

[fishtank]

It's a national thing....
No. 1064/11
Ref E4
Date: 16 December 2011

The National brief for Operations Managers is clear;
· The agreed policy is that Managers must support staff in making the right decisions, making sure that everyone is prepared and knows how to minimise the risk of having accidents through good communication, risk controls and adjustments, strictly adhering to safety standards, working methods, equipment and Protective Clothing use etc.
· Members are asked to remain aware of safety hazards and if they feel their delivery walk has become too dangerous or inaccessible due to poor weather, Managers will support their decision not to carry on and will encourage them to return to the office.
· The decision on the day about whether to continue with deliveries should be taken locally by the Delivery Office Manager, with involvement of employees and CWU Safety Reps, so everyone has a say. While a decision to suspend, given Royal Mail's Universal Service Obligations (USO), should not be taken lightly, if it is the right thing to do in the conditions then that option should be taken and Deliveries/Collections will be suspended.! A manager should not assume that they have to send employees out on collection or delivery where it is clearly unsafe to do so

[RedBagMan]

I thought we weren't paid "to show initiative or thought" (quote from Bogstandard - Nov 28th)

[Lounge Lizard]

It's a national thing....
No. 1064/11
Ref E4
Date: 16 December 2011

The National brief for Operations Managers is clear;
· The agreed policy is that Managers must support staff in making the right decisions, making sure that everyone is prepared and knows how to minimise the risk of having accidents through good communication, risk controls and adjustments, strictly adhering to safety standards, working methods, equipment and Protective Clothing use etc.
· Members are asked to remain aware of safety hazards and if they feel their delivery walk has become too dangerous or inaccessible due to poor weather, Managers will support their decision not to carry on and will encourage them to return to the office.
· The decision on the day about whether to continue with deliveries should be taken locally by the Delivery Office Manager, with involvement of employees and CWU Safety Reps, so everyone has a say. While a decision to suspend, given Royal Mail's Universal Service Obligations (USO), should not be taken lightly, if it is the right thing to do in the conditions then that option should be taken and Deliveries/Collections will be suspended.! A manager should not assume that they have to send employees out on collection or delivery where it is clearly unsafe to do so

- not read that before but it's interesting. and surely "support staff in making the right decisions" and "everyone has a say" is wrong as Health and Safety matters are to be decided by a 'competant person' and whereas it is assumed that DOMs will have had the necessary H&S training there's no way that all of us are 'competant' enough in such matters.

[Lincox]

How does this apply in rural sPDOs where we have no direct contact with a DOM and Line Managers are having to cover a fair few SPDOs? How can they be expected to know what local conditions are like when SPDOs can be 30/40 mile apart. Weather conditions in our SPDO can be vastly different to the in city DO which is less than 10 miles away. Who,s going to make a decision as it is impossible for H&S reps, DOM or LIno to cover such a widespread area with differing weather conditions.

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

surely "support staff in making the right decisions" and "everyone has a say" is wrong as Health and Safety matters are to be decided by a 'competant person' and whereas it is assumed that DOMs will have had the necessary H&S training there's no way that all of us are 'competant' enough in such matters.

Actually we are all responsible for our own health and safety not just a competent person, we are supposed to "take reasonable care of our own health and safety"

[fishtank]

It should work like this...
The Delivery Office Manager will take responsibility for deciding whether deliveries should be suspended, taking on board any concerns raised by the H&S rep and members.
Once out on delivery since your DOM is not with you the responsibility transfers to you to decide whether individual delivery points are dangerous or continuing with the delivery is dangerous.
Managers will support their decision not to carry on and will encourage them to return to the office.

To be honest it sounds like a sensible plan to me...if it is not abused by either side.

[keithposty]

its called a severe weather action plan.
it is incorporated into WRAP and you use the drop down program to instigate this policy on the day.
i still use the old severe weather plan as well as the online version.

the dom and rep make the decision to suspend delivery or not,

not the employee

the only time an employee can refuse is if a direction will cause an immediate threat to a persons health and saftey or his/her action will effect some one else

section 100 employment rights act

[fishtank]

the dom and rep make the decision to suspend delivery or not,

not the employee

the only time an employee can refuse is if a direction will cause an immediate threat to a persons health and saftey or his/her action will effect some one else

That's not true keith.
The decision to suspend deliveries lies with the delivery office manager.
The H&S rep should have input into that decision as should the members who have local knowledge of delivery conditions but the final decision rests with the DOM.
Once out on delivery the member has the final say on what he/she considers to be dangerous,if continuing on delivery is considered to be dangerous then the member can decide to return to the office and management should support that decision.

[keithposty]

the ultimate decision does stop with the dom, thats true but its a joint decision

that was confirmed with the regional h & s director from royal mail in a meeting i attended

it is all incorporated now in the SAC 3 document which he himself signs off

[Lincox]

So can I clarify my understanding of this. Before we go out the decision on whether we go out is entirely the responsibility of the DOM albeit aided by H&S rep and local union rep. However, once we are out on the round, the decision to abort is entirely up to us and the DOM should lend his full support to our own personal decision. Is my understanding correct?

[brothermagrew]

So can I clarify my understanding of this. Before we go out the decision on whether we go out is entirely the responsibility of the DOM albeit aided by H&S rep and local union rep. However, once we are out on the round, the decision to abort is entirely up to us and the DOM should lend his full support to our own personal decision. Is my understanding correct?

Nope there is know mention of the local union rep (in that capacity) only as an employee. The decision on the day about whether to continue with deliveries should be taken locally by the Delivery Office Manager, with involvement of employees and CWU Safety Reps, so everyone has a say.

It quite frankly is a health and safety issue, so why therefore should the Industrial Relations Reps get involved they have enough on their plates with I.R. issues. Leave health and safety issues to the CWU health and safety reps.