Postman's input on revised walks...?

[Terry Butcher]

In my office we start park and loop next Monday (15th Nov). Me and the guy I'm paired with have been given the new duty sheets that show all the drops on the walk and how it is split between us via "park and loop". It's essentially layed out how it will appear on the frames next week. The problem is that they seem far too simplistic and lack any real human input from someone who has done the walks before. For example, one of the designated parking places is in the middle of a road that links two very busy A roads, a rat-run road that has speed bumps down it's entire length and very limited parking spaces down just one side, in short - a parking nightmare. It would make far more sense to park on one of the little roads just off it and loop from there. Elsewhere, we are expected to split streets that today take no more than 30 mins on the average day - a 15 minute loop each (too short?). I think they have split it because there are actually quite a lot of drops, but they are narrow terraced streets that can be done quickly and rarely get much mail. I could go on but you get the idea.

My question is really to the people who are currently doing revised walks via park and loop, how much input were you allowed to give before they were finalised? Did they actually listen to you and alter the walks based on your suggestions or was the computer always right? It just slightly bothers me that next week i might have to do walks that are layed out for the ideal world rather than the real world...just because the computer says so.

[Guevarista]

On several occasions during WTLL sessions during the Summer we were told by our DOM that we'd each get to spend 'quality time' (something I usually reserve for family & friends!) with the planner before any revisions were made. This would allow us to pre-empt any issues regarding parking, terrain, access etc prior to data being input into georoute.
Needless to say, this never took place, so we've now been presented with oversized, unachievable walks which might work in Lincolnshire or Milton Keynes, but certainly won't in a South Wales valleys office where the vast majority of housing has been built on the side of a hill! Additional clangers have been the placing of Park and Loop points on double yellows/bus stops (all of them on my current walk!), multi-storey blocks containing flats with individual letterboxes on each door (tenements, I believe our Scottish cousins, call them) being assessed as single delivery multi-drops, cul-de-sacs magically becoming walk-throughs, and the whole area miraculously transformed to a terrain resembling a pancake!
The knock on effect is that we have been allocated at least five fewer vans than required, we have five HCT routes where a heavily laden trolley will have to be pushed uphill, and we have at least one walk that contains over 30 minutes of dead-walking - and that's by geouroute's highly optimistic reckoning!

[DGP1]

While they get their savings they'll never allow us to interfere, I caught in two minds whether to fight the changes or just let them come in and let RM deal with the consequences.

[fishtank]

While they get their savings they'll never allow us to interfere, I caught in two minds whether to fight the changes or just let them come in and let RM deal with the consequences.

I would always favour input DGP but when it gets to the stage Guevarista is at...and there obviously hasn't been any meaningful input....i would say let them hang themselves.
...but you obviously have to look after yourselves because as soon as it becomes apparent that it isn't working they'll try to make it work using Royal Mail's tried and tested motivational techniques.

[dvbuk55]

While they get their savings they'll never allow us to interfere, I caught in two minds whether to fight the changes or just let them come in and let RM deal with the consequences.

I would always favour input DGP but when it gets to the stage Guevarista is at...and there obviously hasn't been any meaningful input....i would say let them hang themselves.
...but you obviously have to look after yourselves because as soon as it becomes apparent that it isn't working they'll try to make it work using Royal Mail's tried and tested motivational techniques.

Ah yes!.....you mean kind words and the manager demonstrating, in person, how it can easily be achieved merely by a little application

[Himaggen]

This is how clever the tried and tested electronic route calculation mechanism is:

Code: Select all

15_  16
|  \ |
|   \|
13_  14
   \
    \
11_ 12
|  \ |
|   \|
9_   10
  \
   \
7_  `8
| \  |
|  \ |
5_  `6
  \
   \
3_  `4
| \  |
|  \ |
1   `2

Just following the lines to follow the 'calculated' most efficient method of delivering mail to sixteen properties!

[Bp1]

On several occasions during WTLL sessions during the Summer we were told by our DOM that we'd each get to spend 'quality time' (something I usually reserve for family & friends!) with the planner before any revisions were made. This would allow us to pre-empt any issues regarding parking, terrain, access etc prior to data being input into georoute.
Needless to say, this never took place, so we've now been presented with oversized, unachievable walks which might work in Lincolnshire or Milton Keynes, but certainly won't in a South Wales valleys office where the vast majority of housing has been built on the side of a hill! Additional clangers have been the placing of Park and Loop points on double yellows/bus stops (all of them on my current walk!), multi-storey blocks containing flats with individual letterboxes on each door (tenements, I believe our Scottish cousins, call them) being assessed as single delivery multi-drops, cul-de-sacs magically becoming walk-throughs, and the whole area miraculously transformed to a terrain resembling a pancake!
The knock on effect is that we have been allocated at least five fewer vans than required, we have five HCT routes where a heavily laden trolley will have to be pushed uphill, and we have at least one walk that contains over 30 minutes of dead-walking - and that's by geouroute's highly optimistic reckoning!

Your Area Rep should be pulling the plug on this! Does he need to grow a pair?

[OnAFlyer]

We've had/are having loads of input, from moving bits of walks around to get them more sensible, to checking and rewriting every loop/parking point on every walk.

If you've just had a computer revision you are f*cked, because the order it puts addresses in is bollocks. On every walk of ours it writes some roads like this:

1-7 'London Street'
13 London Street
9-11 London Street


When the road runs in a straightforward 1-13. Flats are all wrong, every block. Any cul de sacs it has you B2B'ing one house at a time, despite the fact that there's an 8' high wall between some of ours that you'd have to keep climbing over

Good luck cos I think you'll need it

[Terry Butcher]

I'm actually quite surprised about how well the planners have been listening to our (the posties) suggestions. I took a few hours of my time one night earlier this week to alter one of the walks i'll be starting on monday, it was a computer generated shambles that made no logical sense with house number patterns like "OnAFlyer" pointed out. Luckily i knew/know the walk well so I pretty much changed the whole thing - made the loops fairer, found far more convenient places to park, corrected the numbering of the roads etc etc and submitted it to the planner the next day. I half expected the sheet to be screwed up and told "the computer knows best" but, to my surprise, was told the following day that he is using my template completely for the new walk.

[DGP1]

I'm actually quite surprised about how well the planners have been listening to our (the posties) suggestions. I took a few hours of my time one night earlier this week to alter one of the walks i'll be starting on monday, it was a computer generated shambles that made no logical sense with house number patterns like "OnAFlyer" pointed out. Luckily i knew/know the walk well so I pretty much changed the whole thing - made the loops fairer, found far more convenient places to park, corrected the numbering of the roads etc etc and submitted it to the planner the next day. I half expected the sheet to be screwed up and told "the computer knows best" but, to my surprise, was told the following day that he is using my template completely for the new walk.

Can you send your planner over to my office because our just did what he was told by his boss and then f***** off and won't come back to explain


He used to say that x office has had the same revision and they're really happy but was shocked when our rep just phoned up that rep and asked

[Spedley]

My input is that the program should calculate the simple route vs the complex route (i.e. 1-13 and not 1-7,13,11-9) and if there is 'X' difference then use just the simple route.