Help!!!!!!!

[countford]

Unauthorised absence-Gross misconduct


Hi, I am a postman in Herts and am currently off sick. I originally went sick on 20th July as I had an operation set for 21st July. This was then cancelled. I informed my DOM and have remained off sick. On the 30th July I informed them that I would not be at my normal residence and that if needed they could contact me on my mobile. On my return to my normal address on the 15th Aug I had numerous letters from my DOM stating the my pay had been stopped and as I hadn't replied to any of his letters that he was charging me with Gross Misconduct. I have been signed off by my GP until 12th Sep. My new operation date is set for the 9th September. Firstly can he stop my pay?.Secondly I beleive I have followed all procedures correctly. I never got any missed calls on my mobile phone and he never left a message on it either. I have a meeting with him on Thursday 19th Aug. Can you help?
Regards
countford

[DGP1]

Where were you? If they think you've just taken 2 weeks holiday and put it down as sick then they will catch you and this is what they've done.

[countford]

Where were you? If they think you've just taken 2 weeks holiday and put it down as sick then they will catch you and this is what they've done.

Hi, Thanks for your reply. I AM off sick awaiting a shoulder operation and got a cancellation as the op wasnt going to be done during that time. My booked annual leave is this week and next week.

[Lincox]

You are signed off by your Doctor who has told you that you should refrain from work during the period he has set. Royal Mail cannot put you under house arrest. Your DOM is a first class twat, and he will probably be given the boot by Royal Mail if he continues with this bullying and harrasment, and there is not one chance of Royal Mail allowing this to get as far as an employment tribunal. Just call his bluff, tell him that you are still off sick and until your doctor informs you that you are fit for work, any further contact should be by letter, and if you happen to be at home, you will respond to them in due course, having consulted with your Doctor on the stress and anxiety that this continual abuse is having upon you.

[countford]

They can and will stop your pay IF they cant contact you when your off. You have to be contactable at all times. Its a directive from higher management. Happened at our place recently. A lad went awol and his pay got stopped, his wife came in to say he was mentally ill etc , but they said they had to see him or else his pay would get stopped, and it was. So the lad in qquestion rang up and said "if i come in on Monday will my pay start again" to which he was told it was no longer in the doms hands and had been taken higher - so he didnt come in for another 6 weeks ! Had a docs note but apparently it doesnt make any difference. They just look at everyone as frauds and no ones genuine, thats why they need to see you. I have to say, he did have lots of previous awol stuff for many years which probably made it look really bad.

My problem is that I wasn't at my address. I never had any missed calls so how would I know that he had written to me asking me in for an interview. He has stated that my phone went to voicemail but he didn't leave any messages. Surely if he wanted to contact me that badly he would of left a message so I could of called him to sort out the non contact

[Lincox]

This guy has told them how he can be contacted. They obviously never made a note of this. They cannot stop you being away from home during a period of sickness. It maybe that your doctor has recommended that you go and sun yourself in the Seychelles as the change in temperature will have a positive effect on your condition. Put a grievance in against this idiot and a letter stating that if your pay is not reinstated with immediate effect, you will have no alternative but to take legal action. Your pay will most definitely be reinstated as they know full well that they are on stony ground with this one.

[Lincox]

Royal Mail can do whatever they want, and will continue to do so unless we have the bottle and courage to stand up and be counted. Challenge them and see what they do. There have been many cases brought up on this forum where members and union reps have challenged them, and if your gut feeling is that you have acted correctly then do not feel intimidated, because this is exactly where RM want you to be. It is better to have challenged and lost, than to have done nothing and lost.

[countford]

Fair enough with the mobile thing - but I think you may have to be contacted at home. Thats what we got told.

Thats what i'm saying. They knew I wasn't at my address yet continued to send 3 letters inviting me in for an interview and explain why I have been off since 20th July without authority and without providing any good reason for this. Can anyone explain this as I cannot for the life of me understand what they are talking about. All the sick certificates are to refrain from work and detail shoulder pain-awaiting surgery. Is that not a good reason?

[uphillstruggle]

One of the conditions of receiving RM sick pay is that you remain at your normal address unless permission has been given for you to be away (or unless you are receiving inpatient treatment of some kind)

By the sounds of it, although you have informed your DOM you would not be at home, you have not been given permission for this. As a result, your RM sick pay has been stopped because you no longer meet the criteria/conditions to be paid it. You should still be receiving statutory sick pay though, as the fact that you are covered by a GP certificate entitles you to this element of your pay.

[countford]

Basically they say if you arent at home, your out and about somehwere, and if you can do that you can work! Unless, as Uphill said, your having treatment.

I myself was off with Cancer ,undergoing treatment, and we went to Wales, just becuase the wife couldnt cope with 3 kids and 2 dogs on her own, so I had the dogs whilst they went out etc. When I eventually went back to work, the DOM said that the weeks leave I had in my sick time off wouldnt be given back to me and I had to forefit it - OR he would follow it up as I didnt tell them I was going away from my home address. My REP advised that I accept this, and whether it was right or wrong, I did. TBH I was just glad to get back to work after 8 months off

Does anyone have a copy of the terms AND conditions regarding the paying of sick pay. I cannot for the life of me understand that if what people are saying is true that they don't have to pay you unless they give you permission to go away then why is that not stated on the first letter outlining the rules you should adhere to. Because I knew nothing of this until I came on here.

[countford]

I only know through experience buddy

Its so they can keep trying to get you back to work though.

I had a slipped disc ,couldnt walk, and had to do excercises every 30 mins. Went to see atos, who said I should do 4hrs a day for a month. The dom rang her and she changed her mind to 8hrs a day . The reasoning was, your only going to be sat at home , so you may aswell sit at work and do killoffs or answer the phones

Yeah I see where your coming from but RM procedures do not allow you to go back to work whilst awaiting an operation and then to go off sick when your date comes up. Thats then classed as 2 absences instead of 1 continous absence. So I have no choice but to be off sick until I have had operation and recovered enough to go back to work. I was on light duties before going sick. They had me driving vans dropping bags off, doing parcels etc. Yet they expect me to break my arse then treat you like poo.

[countford]

I only know through experience buddy

Its so they can keep trying to get you back to work though.

I had a slipped disc ,couldnt walk, and had to do excercises every 30 mins. Went to see atos, who said I should do 4hrs a day for a month. The dom rang her and she changed her mind to 8hrs a day . The reasoning was, your only going to be sat at home , so you may aswell sit at work and do killoffs or answer the phones

Yeah I see where your coming from but RM procedures do not allow you to go back to work whilst awaiting an operation and then to go off sick when your date comes up. Thats then classed as 2 absences instead of 1 continous absence. So I have no choice but to be off sick until I have had operation and recovered enough to go back to work. I was on light duties before going sick. They had me driving vans dropping bags off, doing parcels etc. Yet they expect me to break my arse then treat you like poo.

Ok can somebody tell me then if I have followed the procedures laid out in the 1st sickness letter is that GROSS MISCONDUCT. Does he have the right to sack me as this is what I am expecting to happen on Thursday after reading between the lines of his letter. Basically The gist of the letter is that I must give him good reasons why he shouldn't sack me. Any help grateful.

[stokes11eg]

:shock:Get in there and fight mate¬you are of sick, the only real arguable point from them could be that you could have contacted them, to keep them up to date, rather than waiting for them to call you.Remind him you are on the sick, and threatening you with the sack is reprehensible--they have a duty to look out for your health and welfare/ Good Luck

[countford]

One of the conditions of receiving RM sick pay is that you remain at your normal address unless permission has been given for you to be away (or unless you are receiving inpatient treatment of some kind)

By the sounds of it, although you have informed your DOM you would not be at home, you have not been given permission for this. As a result, your RM sick pay has been stopped because you no longer meet the criteria/conditions to be paid it. You should still be receiving statutory sick pay though, as the fact that you are covered by a GP certificate entitles you to this element of your pay.

Thanks for your reply. Could you explain this to me if poss. I rang DOM this morning to ask if my pay has been re-instated and he obviously said no. When I asked on what condition this has been stopped he replied with-Your pay has been stopped because I have not given a good enough reason for my absence. Surely unless i'm missing something here the GP note has clearly stated that im off coz of shoulder awaiting surgery. Prior to going off sick I was removed from my walk to do 2 "light duties" This has been the same since March. It became unbearable after the continous driving and lifting of parcels, bags etc.

[Lincox]

This is verging on the farcical. Stand up for your rights and tell him that you will gladly meet him at an industrial tribunal whereby he will be asked by the panel to explain the reasons why your Doctors Fitness Note stating that you were incapable of carrying out any duty, is not sufficient, and why does he consider himself to have more knowledge about your state of health than your own GP has, which leads him to the conclusion that you are swinging the lead and therefore he is in a position to terminate your employment.