De-recognising a trade union

[fishtank]

Just putting it out there due to the ridiculously low turn-out.

Statutory derecognition of a trade union owing to lack of support for bargaining arrangements
You can - at any time - make a request to a recognised trade union to end collective bargaining arrangements on the grounds that the union no longer has the support of the bargaining unit. The union can decline the request.

However, if the union declines a request after three years of statutory recognition, you can apply to the Central Arbitration Committee (CAC) to hold a secret ballot.

Similarly, where a worker believes that their union no longer has the support of the bargaining unit, they can apply to the CAC to hold a secret ballot - but only after three years of statutory recognition.

A worker's application to the CAC
Where a worker believes that their union no longer has the support of the bargaining unit, they can apply to the CAC to hold a secret ballot to determine whether or not collective bargaining arrangements should end.

A worker can only make such an application after three years of statutory recognition. However, unlike employers, they do not need to first make a request of the union (or even the employer) to end bargaining arrangements.

The CAC will only accept the worker's ballot application if:

it is made in the proper form
1. they have copied the application and any supporting documents to both you and the union
2. at least 10 per cent of the workers in the bargaining unit favour derecognition
3. a majority of the workers in the bargaining unit are likely to favour derecognition
4. there hasn't been a previous application for an end to the bargaining arrangements in the last three years

The CAC's decision following the worker's application
Starting with the day after that on which it receives the worker's application, the CAC normally has ten working days in which to decide whether or not the worker's application to the CAC is admissible.

If the CAC decides that the worker's application is not admissible, it must not accept the application and the issue ends there.

If the CAC decides that the worker's application is admissible, it must accept the application. The CAC must then give notice of this acceptance decision to the worker, the employer and the union.

In reaching its decision, the CAC panel may, where it considers it appropriate, convene a hearing. The parties will be invited to attend and present evidence to the panel.

The consequences of the CAC accepting the worker's application
Where the CAC accepts a worker's application, it normally has 20 working days - starting with the day after the CAC gives notice that it has accepted the application - to help you, the union and the worker negotiate with a view to either agreeing that the worker will withdraw the application, or reaching an agreement that the parties will end the bargaining arrangements.

If - in the 20-day period - the parties agree to end the bargaining arrangements or the worker agrees to withdraw the application, the CAC will cease its considerations.

If the parties fail to reach an agreement in the 20-day period, the CAC must arrange for the holding of a secret ballot

[dvbuk55]

Just putting it out there due to the ridiculously low turn-out.

Statutory derecognition of a trade union owing to lack of support for bargaining arrangements
You can - at any time - make a request to a recognised trade union to end collective bargaining arrangements on the grounds that the union no longer has the support of the bargaining unit. The union can decline the request.

However, if the union declines a request after three years of statutory recognition, you can apply to the Central Arbitration Committee (CAC) to hold a secret ballot.

Similarly, where a worker believes that their union no longer has the support of the bargaining unit, they can apply to the CAC to hold a secret ballot - but only after three years of statutory recognition.

A worker's application to the CAC
Where a worker believes that their union no longer has the support of the bargaining unit, they can apply to the CAC to hold a secret ballot to determine whether or not collective bargaining arrangements should end.

A worker can only make such an application after three years of statutory recognition. However, unlike employers, they do not need to first make a request of the union (or even the employer) to end bargaining arrangements.

The CAC will only accept the worker's ballot application if:

it is made in the proper form
1. they have copied the application and any supporting documents to both you and the union
2. at least 10 per cent of the workers in the bargaining unit favour derecognition
3. a majority of the workers in the bargaining unit are likely to favour derecognition
4. there hasn't been a previous application for an end to the bargaining arrangements in the last three years

The CAC's decision following the worker's application
Starting with the day after that on which it receives the worker's application, the CAC normally has ten working days in which to decide whether or not the worker's application to the CAC is admissible.

If the CAC decides that the worker's application is not admissible, it must not accept the application and the issue ends there.

If the CAC decides that the worker's application is admissible, it must accept the application. The CAC must then give notice of this acceptance decision to the worker, the employer and the union.

In reaching its decision, the CAC panel may, where it considers it appropriate, convene a hearing. The parties will be invited to attend and present evidence to the panel.

The consequences of the CAC accepting the worker's application
Where the CAC accepts a worker's application, it normally has 20 working days - starting with the day after the CAC gives notice that it has accepted the application - to help you, the union and the worker negotiate with a view to either agreeing that the worker will withdraw the application, or reaching an agreement that the parties will end the bargaining arrangements.

If - in the 20-day period - the parties agree to end the bargaining arrangements or the worker agrees to withdraw the application, the CAC will cease its considerations.

If the parties fail to reach an agreement in the 20-day period, the CAC must arrange for the holding of a secret ballot

Now there is a real alternative I suppose but it would take some organising but really a very interesting piece of research ft

[SpacePhoenix]

Very bad idea, if it were to happen would RM then ever recognise a new union as would a new union get enough support?

[BELIAL]

Very bad idea, if it were to happen would RM then ever recognise a new union as would a new union get enough support?

Read the first bit. Once membership drops below a certain % RM legally have the power to derecognise the union, whatever the union says.

[mr hil.]

Lets all join the CMA and fight them from within

[horris_1uk]

Maybe not a change in union just a change in executives and hierarchy?

[fishtank]

The Flip side for SpacePheonix

Statutory Trade Union Recognition
The Procedure
a) The first step

•An independent trade union (or two or more unions acting together) will write to the employer to make a formal application for recognition.
•It will state that it believes it has the support of a group of workers whom it wishes to represent. This group is referred to as the "bargaining unit".
•The employer has 10 days to respond

b) If the employer agrees to recognition

•If the employer agrees to recognise the union in respect of the particular group of workers, the next step is to decide what the bargaining powers should cover.
•Bargaining covers such matters such as pay, conditions of service, etc.

c) If the employer disagrees

•If the employer is unhappy with the proposal, but is willing to negotiate, both parties have 20 days to try and reach an agreement. ACAS (Advisory, Conciliation and Arbitration Service) may be called upon to help with the negotiations.
•If the employer fails to respond or rejects the application outright, or if no agreement is reached after negotiating, the union may turn to the CAC for assistance.

d) The 10% test

•The CAC has to decide whether there is evidence to suggest that the union is right in believing that a majority of the bargaining unit it proposes would be in favour of recognition.
•The union has to prove that 10% or more of the proposed bargaining unit are members of the union.
•The union has to provide evidence of support, such as membership records or a petition signed by a sufficient number of employees.
•The employer is also allowed to submit evidence of union support, for example, if union membership fees are paid by payroll deductions.

e) Deciding on the Bargaining Unit

•If the union passes the 10% test but agreement still cannot be reached on the appropriate bargaining unit, then the CAC will step in.
•The CAC will then decide what the appropriate bargaining unit will be, bearing in mind the views of the employer and the union, and whether the unit is compatible for effective management of the business.
•If the CAC decides that the bargaining unit should be different from the one originally proposed, then the 10% test has to be applied again.

f) The 50% test

•If agreement is reached at this stage the CAC issues a declaration that the union is recognised for this bargaining unit.
•If the employer disagrees, then the CAC will still issue a declaration of recognition if 50% of the unit are members of the trade union in question.
•If the employer can prove that a majority of members of the unit do not want recognition, the CAC will arrange a secret ballot of the proposed bargaining unit, to be conducted by an independent body.
•The cost of the ballot will be shared between employer and union.
•Employees campaigning for the ballot will be protected
•The employer has to grant the union reasonable access to the employees to be balloted.

g) The outcome

•The CAC will award recognition if it is supported by:
i) a majority of those voting; and
ii) at least 40% of workers entitled to vote
•In the case of the union failing to achieve recognition, it will not be able to apply again for three years

[qwert]

sounds good.they have got to go.

[Martin Walsh]

It will never happen . Royal mail do not want to deal with 166 000 indivduals it is to time consuming. The turn out was above the normal percentage for a consultative trade union ballot!

[fishtank]

And of course if Royal Mail decide to de-recognise..........

Your request to the union for derecognition
To be valid, your request must:

1. be in writing
2. be received by the union
3. identify the bargaining arrangements
4. state that the request is made under Schedule A1 of the Trade Union and Labour Relations (Consolidation) Act 1992
5. Once the union receives your request, the union has ten working days to respond, starting with the day after the union receives your request.

If - before the end of the ten-day period - the union agrees to end the bargaining arrangement, the matter ends there.

If the union either fails to respond to your request or - before the end of the ten-day period - tells you that it doesn't accept your request (and does not indicate a willingness to negotiate), you may apply to the CAC for the holding of a secret ballot to decide whether or not collective bargaining should end.

If - before the end of ten-day period - the union tells you that it doesn't accept your request but is willing to negotiate, you and the union (the parties) have 20 working days - starting with the working day immediately following the end of the ten-day period - to negotiate with a view to agreeing to end the bargaining arrangements.

During this 20-day period, the parties may request the assistance of Acas in their negotiations. The parties can agree to extend this period as required.

Your application to the CAC

If the parties fail to reach an agreement, you may apply to the CAC for the holding of a secret ballot to decide whether or not the bargaining arrangements should end.

The CAC will only accept your ballot application if:

1. it is made in the proper form
2. you have copied the application and any supporting documents to the union
3. at least 10 per cent of the workers in the bargaining unit favour derecognition
4. a majority of the workers in the bargaining unit are likely to favour derecognition
5. there hasn't been a previous application for an end to the bargaining arrangements in the last three years

The CAC's decision following your application

Starting with the day after that on which it receives your application, the CAC normally has ten working days in which to decide whether or not:

1. your request to the union is valid
2. you negotiated properly with the union if you were required to do so
3. your application to the CAC is admissible
If the CAC decides that you have failed to meet any or all of these requirements, it will not accept the application and the issue ends there.

If the CAC decides that you have met all of these requirements, it will accept your application and arrange for the holding of a secret ballot
In reaching its decision, the CAC panel may, where it considers it appropriate, convene a hearing. The parties will be invited to attend and present evidence to the panel.

[numan]

It will never happen . Royal mail do not want to deal with 166 000 indivduals it is to time consuming. The turn out was above the normal percentage for a consultative trade union ballot!

It won't be quite so time consuming after all the VRs/natural wastage and closing of MCs.

[fishtank]

It will never happen . Royal mail do not want to deal with 166 000 indivduals it is to time consuming. The turn out was above the normal percentage for a consultative trade union ballot!

Well dingo they are about to deal with 1200 seperate units.

[Carnoustie]

If the CAC decides that you have met all of these requirements, it will accept your application and arrange for the holding of a secret ballot

Well I hope to God any de-recognition ballot doesn't need 51% of those balloted to vote Yes.

On today's evidence, half wouldn't bother to vote at all, so you'd then need almost 100% of the returned balloted papers to be Yes votes

[dvbuk55]

It will never happen . Royal mail do not want to deal with 166 000 indivduals it is to time consuming. The turn out was above the normal percentage for a consultative trade union ballot!

You should never say never dingo - the days of idlers and hangers on is swiftly coming to an end. The union is now populated by self servers and none too literate at that - no wonder the agreements are like they are, I sometimes wonder if the only part of the agreement they understand is OK and their signature and if the cap fits.

For too long able people have stood by and let those less able push themselves to the front, the light is beginning to dawn on some that they have allowed semi literates become a voice - tragic!

[numan]

It will never happen . Royal mail do not want to deal with 166 000 indivduals it is to time consuming. The turn out was above the normal percentage for a consultative trade union ballot!

You should never say never dingo - the days of idlers and hangers on is swiftly coming to an end. The union is now populated by self servers and none to literate at that - no wonder the agreements are like they are, I sometimes wonder if the only part of the agreement they understand is OK and their signature and if the cap fits.

For too long able people have stood by and let those less able push themselves to the front, the light is beginning to dawn on some that they have allowed semi literates become a voice - tragic!

Totally agree with this. This agreement and the P&M deal before it are both full of wishy washy, non specific jargon. Then we get such as Dingo on here saying this is ok because he and other insiders know exactly what it all means. WTF is that all about?