Election Material - Bob Gibson to Peter Walls (RM IR Manager

[Geezer]

Date: Friday, 16 April, 2010, 14:04

Peter



Thanks for your reply. You are correct in that you were elsewhere in
2005. However the document I quote from is the National Agreement and
any statement made contrary to that is quite frankly a lie. I have
included for your information a zip file which hopefully will clear this
matter up once and for all and prove that Royal Mail has been misled by
one of its managers who has behaved in a very similar fashion before,
when dealing with the Indoor Workload Tool (IWT) hence me copying Peter
Sinnott in on this email.



You will see from the attached documents that the individual concerned
does not even know himself what was agreed. If you read the documents in
numerical order, you will see in document No1 that there is an exchange
of emails, and I would ask you to scroll down to John Powell's email to
Dale Lang. Please note the words in bold.



If you then go to document No2 which is the 'Agreement' that Dale sent
to me recently you will see the relevant words highlighted in yellow,
please note that they are not the same as the words quoted by John
Powell, so which words are you working from. The reason for the
confusion is quite simple; neither of the words are those finally agreed
with the CWU on the 6th April 2005. They are a cover up for what was
agreed and a disingenuous attempt (after the event) to mislead people
into believing they were.



Document No3 contains exchanges between Dale and I over this matter and
should be self explanatory.



Document No4 is the LTB that I issued after the meeting on the 6th April
2005. Please note the words contained in the LTB and ask yourself why I
would issue those words in the LTB the day after the meeting if we had
agreed something else.



If you now go to document No5 which is the PEC document containing the
actual agreement, and the amendments carried against the original PE
document, how could I possibly think that I could go back to the same
group of people, the PEC with a document that was untrue and did not
adequately deal with the amendments they had carried against it in the
first place. That does not make any sense and I could not possible have
got away with it. It is important to note what the amendment from Joe
Malone and Dave warren was asking for which also supports the CWU
position on this matter.



I have copied Dave Wilshire in on this email as he was the PEC member
dealing with election material on behalf of the dept and he can confirm
that your document is not the agreement and ours is. The facts speak for
themselves.



Document No6 is a letter I sent to John Powell after we had agreed the
document on the 6th and after we had cleared the document with the PEC.



Finally document No7 is a letter sent to Dale which provides further
clarification of what went on.



In closing did we discuss poll cards arriving in with the ordinary mail,
yes we did and we all accepted that this would be minimal and of no
consequence - hence the words in the actual agreement. In fact John
Powell left the room to consult with someone regarding the words in the
actual agreement to see if they were acceptable, even though they were
in fact the words he suggested in the meeting. Although leaving the room
to consult someone is a strange thing to do when you are supposedly
leading the negotiations we did not object as we were there to conclude
the agreement and get back to the PEC for their approval, which we did.
I would hope that someone can see that the sequence of events and the
documents I have sent point clearly to the CWU agreement being the real
agreement.



Obviously there is a lesson to be learnt and unfortunately it does
nothing to support the words and intentions of the new agreement. There
can be no trust when people behave the way they have regarding the
election material agreement.



I would hope that you will now be in a position to abide by the real
national agreement.

Bob Gibson
CWU Assistant Secretary - Outdoor

Outdoor Postal Dept
CWU HQ
150 The Broadway
Wimbledon
London SW19 1RX
Tel: 0208 971 7276
Fax: 0208 254 8577
CWU Website: http://www.cwu.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Cut Off King]

WoW Royal mail not sticking to an agreement, well I never....

[mdm]

WoW Royal mail not sticking to an agreement, well I never....

Sorry but i can't agree with your cynicism, as we all know RM never ever lie and always uphold all agreements made. Shame on you!

[fishtank]

Obviously there is a lesson to be learnt and unfortunately it does
nothing to support the words and intentions of the new agreement. There
can be no trust when people behave the way they have regarding the
election material agreement

Yes a lesson to be learnt.........
Anybody up for some education? Dave....Bob....

[gb93]

Now thats what i call usefull information well done Geezer, and without any spin attached.

Anyone remember lovejoy .

GOOD POST proper information .

[pokos27]

it seems we are getting 5p per item even unaddressed ukip.

[Steviea34]

it seems we are getting 5p per item even unaddressed ukip.

Not surprised there are problems with RM and payments - maybe it is time the CWU managed to
negotiate a single rate for everyone, 2010 deal - winners & losers, Election payment rates - Winners
& Losers - anyone notice a theme here

[guvenor]

so if rm are breaking an agreement what are cwu hq doing about it or will we just leave it to local issues again

[Pinky 1]

WoW Royal mail not sticking to an agreement, well I never....

Sorry but i can't agree with your cynicism, as we all know RM never ever lie and always uphold all agreements made. Shame on you!

By the way, nice work Geezer

[postghost]

The main concern for me is that the CWU leadership are still too dumb to actually grab the bull by the horns here.

Are they still quite happy for a yes vote??

[dvbuk55]

They'll be perfectly happy for a yes vote, they've pushed hard enough for it.

Only fools never learn from the mistakes of the past, they are unfortunately not the ones who will be paying the price, we will, though I hope enough members take there business elsewhere in sufficient numbers to make their displeasure known.

[Stormproof]

I delivered a load of poll cards last year when I was on a rural duty, did'nt know we got paid extra for them Will inform the guys on rurals as this year the majority of Polling Cards for town walks (not rurals) are being hand delivered by council workers

[dongash]

HAD ALL THE POLLING CARDS FOR MY TOWN DELIVERY, AND ALL THE POSTAL VOTE ONES (PINK) ALL FRANKED FIRST CLASS. THE COUNCIL STAFF USED TO DELIVER THEM, BAR THE RURAL ONES???? WHAT IS GOING ON? POLL CARDS "MINIMAL", MY ARSE!!!!

[Midge]

Surely the arguments over what items we should be paid for delivering, and which agreement is the the real agreement, will all be ended once and for all when the CWU produce a copy of the original, signed agreement with all the signatures from the Royal Mail negotiators on it?

There MUST be one somewhere, surely?

[POSTMAN]

So,no updates on this this?