My mind made up at last........IT'S A SOLID NO!

[Just_My_Opinion]

I've read and re-read the agreement. I have listened and read views from all sides of the spectrum. The agreement deserves nothing more than a resounding no. I have been debating on what way to vote for a few days/weeks now. I can see good points in it but unfortunately the bad points far, far out weigh them. The only people justifying this deal are some union reps both on and off this forum.

The reason for my no vote is quite simple and is based on three points.

(1) The current agreement is no result for men and women who have lost numerous days pays for strike action.

(2) The current agreement is no result for 4 months (4 bloody months! JOKE!) supposed negotiating.

(3) This is what sealed my no vote thanks to lovejoy, Dingo and The Truth. Any agreement which senior union reps have to justify is a good thing to the members is doomed in my eyes before we even vote. lovejoy, Dingo and The Truth surely if this agreement was good for us all you wouldn't have to spend so much time and effort trying to sell us it?

Were not stupid and the most of us can see the agreement for what it's worth. Might have took me a few days to realise in it's entirety what it's worth but I got there in the end thanks to The Truth, Dingo and lovejoy.

Surely after numerous days pay lost to the strike action and 4 months negotiating the very least we the paying members should expect is an agreement which sells itself?????

[robd]

In my opinion,and i'm prepared to be corrected here,but the way it reads to me,is the union appear to be
saying,this is the deal,if you don't like it,leave.
My understanding is the union is there to represent it's members interests,this deal certainly doesn't,and if it's
a no vote,so be it,we let them know that.
i don't think that means we have to take further industrial action,but the union will have to listen to what the
members are actually saying.
The no.1 concern for the majority of delivery staff,is not pay or conditions,but workload(and the managerial bullying that
goes with it)
Both parties agree that we now have to work harder than ever,but more importantly,we will have to be capable of acheiving a top 10% rating up until we are 65!
We have just experienced the sheer brutality of this,when a postman in his 50s,was forced to leave against his wishes(ill health retired)because he wasn't 'fit for purpose'.
No part of the agreement covers this,indeed all health and safety aspects appear to of deteriorated,when a bulk posting arrives,and you would get 2/3 days to deliver,you can expect to take the lot,because you've got a lovely new trolley that does the job for you.
The biggest worry the union has brought on itself,is,as long as i've been a postman,my colleagues have always assured me,we'd be a lot worse off without the union,now those same colleagues are beginning to question this.

[DirtyHarry]

This agreement would stand up for itself, were it truly beneficial to postal workers, as it is, what with the CWU circus travelling all over the country to try and sell one hideously expensive crock of shite, it cannot, will not.

[Just_My_Opinion]

This agreement would stand up for itself, were it truly beneficial to postal workers, as it is, what with the CWU circus travelling all over the country to try and sell one hideously expensive crock of shite, it cannot, will not.

Yip totally agree mate. If the agreement is going to benefit us so much why as you say does the CWU circus feel the need to travel the country to convince it's members to vote yes. Surely the very fact they have to try and sell the agreement is reason enough to show it's not what we the paying members of the CWU want or deserve.

[Straight4ward]

I would have thought that judging by the comments on here over the last week that it was fairly obvious why it is necessary for Dave Ward & co. to "sell" it to members.
However, that doesn't make it a bad deal, just that, to date, they haven't been successful in getting their message across.

[Just_My_Opinion]

I would have thought that judging by the comments on here over the last week that it was fairly obvious why it is necessary for Dave Ward & co. to "sell" it to members.
However, that doesn't make it a bad deal, just that, to date, they haven't been successful in getting their message across.

Erm, surely if it was a such good deal the CWU wouldn't have to try sell it or try and get their message across? Surely after 4 months of talks this deal should be the dogs dangly bits and sell it's self. We the paying members should all be rushing to post back our ballot papers with a big X beside the yes square if this agreement was so good on paper.

[Straight4ward]

I rest my case.

[CourtneyCox]

I would have thought that judging by the comments on here over the last week that it was fairly obvious why it is necessary for Dave Ward & co. to "sell" it to members.
However, that doesn't make it a bad deal, just that, to date, they haven't been successful in getting their message across.

Erm, surely if it was a such good deal the CWU wouldn't have to try sell it or try and get their message across? Surely after 4 months of talks this deal should be the dogs dangly bits and sell it's self. We the paying members should all be rushing to post back our ballot papers with a big X beside the yes square if this agreement was so good on paper.

I don't want to start a conspiracry theory but if the deal was good for the Organisation but not the membership, then perhaps you would have to talk it up to try and get it through. Thats why you have to read the proposal in 3 ways, as an individual, as an employee and as a CWU member, then balance the losses and gains and make your own mind up.

[DirtyHarry]

Yip totally agree mate. If the agreement is going to benefit us so much why as you say does the CWU circus feel the need to travel the country to convince it's members to vote yes. Surely the very fact they have to try and sell the agreement is reason enough to show it's not what we the paying members of the CWU want or deserve.

The CWU have become the modern day equivalent of the snake oil salesmen that used to travel all over the old American West, selling crap to mugs easily parted with their money. A sad state of affairs, but hey, hardly surprising, given what this country and it's people have become.

[Just_My_Opinion]

I would have thought that judging by the comments on here over the last week that it was fairly obvious why it is necessary for Dave Ward & co. to "sell" it to members.
However, that doesn't make it a bad deal, just that, to date, they haven't been successful in getting their message across.

Erm, surely if it was a such good deal the CWU wouldn't have to try sell it or try and get their message across? Surely after 4 months of talks this deal should be the dogs dangly bits and sell it's self. We the paying members should all be rushing to post back our ballot papers with a big X beside the yes square if this agreement was so good on paper.

I don't want to start a conspiracry theory but if the deal was good for the Organisation but not the membership, then perhaps you would have to talk it up to try and get it through. Thats why you have to read the proposal in 3 ways, as an individual, as an employee and as a CWU member, then balance the losses and gains and make your own mind up.

Surely every single paying member of the CWU who works for Royal Mail should benefit? Not one individual here or one employee here or a CWU member over there. This agreement benefits very few people.

[Just_My_Opinion]

I rest my case.

Erm, OK then......

[belle smith]

I would have thought that judging by the comments on here over the last week that it was fairly obvious why it is necessary for Dave Ward & co. to "sell" it to members.
However, that doesn't make it a bad deal, just that, to date, they haven't been successful in getting their message across.

No what makes it a bad deal is;
1. that it makes our job physically more demanding.
2. its a paycut for most people.
3. we have agreed to the use of pegasus and IWT, with as of yet unseen standards, and even when they are seen they are not part of the agreement.

ps. just my opinion.....you didn't strike me as a waverior anyway.

[fishtank]

I would have thought that judging by the comments on here over the last week that it was fairly obvious why it is necessary for Dave Ward & co. to "sell" it to members.
However, that doesn't make it a bad deal, just that, to date, they haven't been successful in getting their message across.

Maybe a quick look through the Management Briefing will show you what DOES make it a bad deal.