quote from CWU WEBSITE.

[ORANGE]

So what exactly do you think the CWU is saying on thier website by quote:-CWU is determined to reach an agreement or make enough progress to call off strike action next week." its the make enough progress bit that bothers me as opposed to an agreement?

[realitybites]

"or make enough progress"
They cannot be serious, once the floodgates are open........................

[Truth]

There is no hope of a full agreement next week.
What’s wrong if there is an ENOUGH progress being made to call off strike action? If members are waiting for a full agreement, then the members are in for a long wait.

[madelin4]

Do you think R M will think that as the weeks go by more and more strikers will have to resort to coming into work because they cannot afford to strike every week?

[not me]

There is no hope of a full agreement next week.
What’s wrong if there is an ENOUGH progress being made to call off strike action? If members are waiting for a full agreement, then the members are in for a long wait.

agreed,i expect as last time an interim agreement will come in and strikes called ff

[DirtyHarry]

If anybody wants to see the strikes called off, just so Higson can mess Hayes & Ward about in what will inevitably be fruitless talks, then prepare yourselves to take on the workload left by the next round of cuts in staff, because the workload won't disappear with those that will be sacked, will it?

No, unless we get a guarantee from RM that those postal workers already working all their paid hours, and were doing so pre-flexibility, pre-absorption, are protected from management bullies intent on pushing even more work on these people, then we tell Mark Higson where he can shove his "period of calm."

[Ahebban]

The 2010-2011 office budget percentage cuts have already been decided and are being 'work-planned' by DIM DOMS as we speak. It might well be decided on the size of your office (0-10% is the expected range), but don't expect any favours forthcoming from RM!

I can see us being in dispute with RM early in the New Year if the existing 2007-2009 Pay & Mod Agmnt is still operational, or its successor is as weak. Any Local Agreements should go before the Branch/Area/Div Rep for review ensuring that they falls within the parameter of National Agreements. Similarly, any RM instruction should be reviewed in light of National Agreements too.

There is nothing to stop an office from going it alone, but they pay the consequence if it should back-fire at a later date.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

So what exactly do you think the CWU is saying on thier website by quote:-CWU is determined to reach an agreement or make enough progress to call off strike action next week." its the make enough progress bit that bothers me as opposed to an agreement?

its saying many things:

To Members: This is going to be a long fight but we are standing up for you. There is a minimum we can accept before we even think of calling off the strikes and we are aware that this is a seminal moment for the CWU. So stay strong and keep supporting us.

To Royal Mail: You know why we are striking and what we are asking for, you know there is a minimum that we can take to our membership so if you do not start to compromise and reach some form of an agreement we can present them with, the strikes will continue. In other words put up or shut up (where have I heard that before )

To Customers: We are looking after our members interests but we are trying to reach an agreement where we can call off the strikes ASAP, please bear with us we are the good guys after all we look after the posties who you know and respect but if management remain intransigent and bullish we are in this for the long haul.

Don't forget that EVERY statement or comment during this dispute by anyone, ultimately has 3 target audiences and you have to read between the lines to see what the real message is.

[Truth]

Can you please read what I wrote?
I repeat, if there is ENOUGH PROGRESS made next week then the NEC should consider calling off strike action. I did not say we should surrender, and am in total agreement with the points raised by DirtyHarry. Yet we need to get real, a full agreement will take many weeks, does he think members will continue to take action into December? Members will start returning to work well before that if they see the union not living in the real world. Sorry but true.

[Phantom]

Yes and there is a minimum the cwu will accept before they call off any strikes so that doesn't mean a full deal does it

[Truth]

Yes and there is a minimum the cwu will accept before they call off any strikes so that doesn't mean a full deal does it

Sorry, who are you having ago at.
"There is a minimum the CWU will accept" , We know that
"so that doesn't mean a full deal does it", We know that to.
I am a bit lost.Whats your point.

[DirtyHarry]

Can you please read what I wrote?
I repeat, if there is ENOUGH PROGRESS made next week then the NEC should consider calling off strike action. I did not say we should surrender, and am in total agreement with the points raised by DirtyHarry. Yet we need to get real, a full agreement will take many weeks, does he think members will continue to take action into December? Members will start returning to work well before that if they see the union not living in the real world. Sorry but true.

Yes, I do credit most of our members with having enough willpower to see these strikes through to the end. Here in London, we've lost around £1000 each in wages due to taking strike action almost every week since the beginning of June, and the signs of a collapse are so few and far between, I can see us taking Royal Mail's bully boys all the way to a decent, honourable, negotiated settlement for all postal workers.
Enough progress, meaning RM have dangled a juicy enough carrot for Hayes & Ward to call off the strikes, only for them to get bogged down in meaningless talks leading us all up the garden path whilst Christmas comes and goes, and then us having to go through another period where we lose even more money in January, is not on, not by a long chalk.
We, all of us, have to accept that we simply cannot trust Crozier & Higson to behave responsibly and honestly in dealing with our union.
They've used every means at their disposal to try and destroy our union's presence in our workplace, along with their allies, the entire UK parliament, we have no friends either in government, or in those parties in a position to form a future government, and we must be as equally ruthless. Calling off the strikes with no firm offer to take to the membership, will be seen as a sign of weakness on the union's part by Crozier & Higson, they will use that weakness to buy themselves time, meanwhile, the busiest time of year will come and go, and we will have to start all over again, but from a weaker position.
Take time to read the RM document leaked to the press a few weeks ago, a document which clearly shows the contempt in which management holds us, read every line, digest every paragraph, then understand why I say we must be equally as ruthless, or suffer the consequences.

[Truth]

Like you I am losing money and I agree with most of what you have to say, most. I have read the RM document you refer to, not good reading. Yet this does not subtract from what I am saying, most members will l be back at work well before Xmas if there is not an agreement, I can see it in my own office (95% out), and yet members are hesitant about on going action. At the end of the day the majority of members have family’s and bills to meet, they are not going to risk their homes are they. The union knows that, that’s why I believe some sort of agreement will be made this week. I will not say any more on the matter, good luck.

[kwikpost]

for too long they've sat on their backsides counting the money we pay in sub's and wondering where they can spend so much without anyone asking to many questions. now they're having to fight to keep their gravy train on track. they can for the first time in their lives see a future where they don't exist. it scares the s**t out of them. it's that reason alone they will i believe fight to the bitter end this time.

[Truth]

for too long they've sat on their backsides counting the money we pay in sub's and wondering where they can spend so much without anyone asking to many questions. now they're having to fight to keep their gravy train on track. they can for the first time in their lives see a future where they don't exist. it scares the s**t out of them. it's that reason alone they will i believe fight to the bitter end this time.

Sorry, I know I said that I would not make any more comment.

Members do need to get real.