Money lost to IA - we'll get it back

[opgpat]

It seems the ONLY argument strike breakers are using is 'I just can't afford to loose the money' and I for one have accepted it and been a bit sympathetic to those collegues - till now.

Look at it this way, RM are according to the 2007 Agreement, in Use of New Technology section, going to introduce 'D2D automation'. That means putting leaflets in an envelope making it part of the normal mail bag. To back that up (as if it needed backing up as it's part of the 2007 agreement) in the leaked RM power-point document they state Phase 4 Future Workings will involve 'd2d into workload, end to seperate payments'.

So we are going to loose 30 odd quid per week if they get their way whcih is only half what we are loosing each week with IA! Now maths is not my strong point but these head-in-the-sand 'can't afford it' types are going to loose it BIG-TIME. 1,500quid a year on average (with 4wks annual leave). As that's the same for all of us, it's simple maths to see that if we have even 25 weeks of 1 day pw IA then we will make our money back within the year - providing we win and keep d2d payments ofcourse. They make the company a huge fortune as we know so don't see why this shouldn't happen, infact we should get more for them - no rise in payment for 13 years now.

1,500 quid EVERY YEAR these 'go in' guys and girls are gonna loose, it will be the financial equivalent of a compulsory day of non-paid IA every fortnight - except of course they will have to go in. We'd all better start getting the word round.

[mpg]

And the banks are ok with waiting 12 months for their mortgage arrears????

[Funked!]

I pointed this out to one of the strike breakers on Thursday last week, he still walked across the picket line.
They want others to fight the battles whilst they earn.
This is why they are the lowest of the low! They would sell their granny for the promise of a few quid.

[opgpat]

And the banks are ok with waiting 12 months for their mortgage arrears????

I would think not. That's why we are on strike ONE day PER WEEK. You can read that again if you're having a bit of trouble, oh and a calculator is available in Windows under Start/All Programs/Accessories menu. Thankyou and...goodnight.

[opgpat]

Oh and when RM start paying us monthly, and the Defined Area Allowance is removed (to be replaced by performance allowance which most of us wont get ofcourse) we will be earning almost the same as what we are with 1 day PW IA! So if they can't meet mortgage payments with 1 day out PW how are they going to meet mortgage payments with 160 quid less per month????? Now go tell your staff they need to sell up and down-size their properties. Go on, TELL THEM THE TRUTH.

[headscrewedon]

opgpat, I thought your logic was good until I realised that, in short, you are saying 'don't worry about losing a day's pay every week, if we win this dispute, we'll keep our D2D payments'

So, you're advocating going on strike to keep our wage exactly the same as it is now. To me, if a job's worth doing, it's worth doing properly, so we should use the leverage we've now got to demand a pay increase AS WELL AS resolving all the other shite that's been going on. If we roll over and accept a 0% pay deal this year, what do you think we'll be offered in 2010 ??

Maybe I'm missing something, but I fail to see how someone taking 16 days action in London is gaining, compared to someone who went in, if our basic stays the same. A loss of well over £1000 (nett) which won't be made good is still a loss. Or are we supposed to be so grateful, after our employer tried to right Royally shaft us and didn't succeed, that we roll over and say 'ooh thanks, don't bother giving us a pay rise, we're so delighted you are keeping our money the same'.

Even though everyone's council tax, food and bills have gone up this year

[BELIAL]

opgpat, I thought your logic was good until I realised that, in short, you are saying 'don't worry about losing a day's pay every week, if we win this dispute, we'll keep our D2D payments'

So, you're advocating going on strike to keep our wage exactly the same as it is now. To me, if a job's worth doing, it's worth doing properly, so we should use the leverage we've now got to demand a pay increase AS WELL AS resolving all the other shite that's been going on. If we roll over and accept a 0% pay deal this year, what do you think we'll be offered in 2010 ??

Maybe I'm missing something, but I fail to see how someone taking 16 days action in London is gaining, compared to someone who went in, if our basic stays the same. A loss of well over £1000 (nett) which won't be made good is still a loss. Or are we supposed to be so grateful, after our employer tried to right Royally shaft us and didn't succeed, that we roll over and say 'ooh thanks, don't bother giving us a pay rise, we're so delighted you are keeping our money the same'.

Even though everyone's council tax, food and bills have gone up this year

You've changed your tune. A little while ago you were urging all to vote no.
Been to Damascus?

[headscrewedon]

You've changed your tune. A little while ago you were urging all to vote no.
Been to Damascus?

No, it's just that once the ballot result is declared, ALL union members go with the majority. I can accept that we are now on strike. I can accept losing money... as long as we then get some back with a pay increase. I ain't striking so I can end up WORSE OFF

[BELIAL]

You've changed your tune. A little while ago you were urging all to vote no.
Been to Damascus?

No, it's just that once the ballot result is declared, ALL union members go with the majority. I can accept that we are now on strike. I can accept losing money... as long as we then get some back with a pay increase. I ain't striking so I can end up WORSE OFF

Solidarity brother ,well said

[Bluebird]

You've changed your tune. A little while ago you were urging all to vote no.
Been to Damascus?

No, it's just that once the ballot result is declared, ALL union members go with the majority. I can accept that we are now on strike. I can accept losing money... as long as we then get some back with a pay increase. I ain't striking so I can end up WORSE OFF

Solidarity brother ,well said

She is a female, solidarity sister

[opgpat]

opgpat, I thought your logic was good until I realised that, in short, you are saying 'don't worry about losing a day's pay every week, if we win this dispute, we'll keep our D2D payments'

Hi headsrewedon,

I can't see what's wrong with that to be honest. We're talking about around 1500quid a year here. If you think that isn't important you obviously don't need the money? Lets be clear, the company want to cut SO much that if we stay where we are with d2d we will have won. I agree it's not good enough that pay for d2d hasn't changed in 13 years and yes we should get a fairer share of the profits they raise.

So not saying we should silently accept standing still but if we stop them eroding our renumeration then that's a victory and one which as I pointed out would see us financially better off after 12months even AFTER taking IA 1 day a week for six months. So the point is to show people complaining about them 'loosing money' is that they aren't loosing anything. Hope that makes sense.

btw what you say about what London guys, or the rest of us, will 'gain' is missleading. This settlement WON'T reimburse the lost pay. It will create a new set of rules for the FUTURE. It may not gain us anything atall and it might only protect our current terms, conditions and pay. In effect the reward IS to stand still but that is a victory over getting a pay cut/sack/havier workload.

[headscrewedon]

So not saying we should silently accept standing still but if we stop them eroding our renumeration then that's a victory and one which as I pointed out would see us financially better off after 12months even AFTER taking IA 1 day a week for six months. So the point is to show people complaining about them 'loosing money' is that they aren't loosing anything. Hope that makes sense.

btw what you say about what London guys, or the rest of us, will 'gain' is missleading. This settlement WON'T reimburse the lost pay. It will create a new set of rules for the FUTURE. It may not gain us anything atall and it might only protect our current terms, conditions and pay. In effect the reward IS to stand still but that is a victory over getting a pay cut/sack/havier workload.

Well I guess we are not going to agree on this.

I am not freezing my derriere off on a picket line in the coming months just so I can return to work with no improvement to my pay and conditions. If we're taking this action right up until Xmas, I say we should be more ambitious than to just be grateful to keep a pay freeze !!

I'm thinking about the long-term damage agreeing to a pay cut will do in terms of what we will get offered next time. Make no mistake, a 0% 'pay rise' when all my living expenses have risen since our last pay deal is a pay cut, and totally unacceptable when I've lost over £1000 so far. By not caving-in today, the PEC have in effect told Royal Mail that we're not stopping until our demands are met. So let's add a pay increase to those demands, if only to send a message that pay freezes are never going to be accepted by this union.

I bet :cfo won't be getting a reduced pay packet when our actions hit RM's profits, so why should we ?

[opgpat]

No I do agree with all of that. BA staff who are balloting for strike action and mostly on a pay scale and most of them are getting increases of around 7% this year!!!!!

I think that's on previously agreed terms but even so we are doing badly out of this RM management team in terms of basic pay. With the recovery on it's way in the UK and inflation in positive territory and likely to rise, a zero % pay award is as you say an actual pay cut.
:cfo