There has to be a tougher policy on dangerous dogs

[emmaa_uk]

I just started with royal mail and have been doing my round for the past 3 weeks. There are 2 delivery points which are potentially quite dangerous, I feel.
One I do not even attempt a delivery because everytime the dog sees me, i just know it wants to go for me and only reason it doesnt is because there is a small gate in front of it. The damn thing follows me from the front garden to back as the property is a corner plot. The owner is an elderly woman who clearly has no control over it which leads me to believe that if it did attack me, there would be stopping it!
Anyway, another place I am uneasy to go to is this one where 3 dogs are behind this wooden gate. I do not know what breed they are but I have been warned one attacked a girl last year who did my round and bit her quite badly. I am trying to find out more but nobody seems to know much or maybe doesnt want to tell me?
Anyway, these dogs have such an acute hearing, that even when I creep they hear me and are banging rather violently against the gate which worries me into wondering how secure the gate actually is because of the force of the dogs, I have seen it shake quite loosely. They bark like mad and growl, its gotten to point I dread going there and want to quit the job as there seems to be alot of dogs on this walk.
I have told my manager but he reckons they cannot act until I am bitten and even then it seems like nothing much will be done. Does anyone else think its unfair that have to wait to be bitten badly until something can be done? If we feel threatened why shouldnt we be allowed to defend ourselves??? If royal mail say our health and safety is paramount, then why do they allow posties to deliver to dangerous areas. Surely, we are more important than some mangy dog!!!
What would happen if I were to get bitten badly?

[morleyposty]

tell you manager to do your walk or even the street/road where these beast reside.

wonder how he/she would feel working day-in-day out (except sun) coming across the dogs.

[baldrick]

Hi emmaa_uk and welcome to rmc
I'm not a delivery postie, but I'm pretty sure you don't have to deliver to an address
if you feel threatened by loose dogs. I'm sure a delivery postie will able to give you
some advice on that, or Brother Macgrew will - he's a Health & Safety Rep and will
be able to give you all the info.

[97gaz]

Your manager is an arse. If you feel threatened by a dog you consider to be dangerous then do not deliver. Especially if it's already bitten someone. Take the mail back or pouch it off. Write on it clearly "dogs loose" and endorse it with the date and your initials. Make sure you tell your "manager" . It's his responsibility to sort it, thats what the lazy sod gets overpaid for. It's called risk assesment and he needs to comply with it!

Recently my manager ( one of the good un's) has been suspending delivery at the first dog bite - no second chances and thats the way it should be.

I have a couple on my float where the regular guys feels the dog isn't a threat but when I'm on they don't get their mail if the dogs out. It also works the other way round. After you've been there a bit longer you'll get fed up of getting bit by dogs and develop a thick skin (no pun intended).

Oh and by the way Royal Mail don't pay you for sitting in A+E for three hours while they update your Tetanus jabs.

[Puppetmaster]

Get your health and safety rep involved,or try recording your Manager saying he cannot do anything till something happens .

Love dogs myself but have had a few runings with them on delivery.Its quite clear what a Manager has do do ,instructions cover it.If a dog bites you all clear-has happened to me very minor,and household and RM were good about it.Also know personaly a guy who was out delivering and had his faced ripped open by a dog.

But why wait to be attacked and bit ,due something about it first.On a round I do sometimes a family moved in recently into a small council terraced house with 2 possibly dangerous dogs.Regular Postie delivers here Ok but with caution,I took 1 look at dog trying to get me throough glass panel front door and scared the life out of me.

Neighbours had said how bad this Dog was,it was a unusual dogg but very firce.I looked the breed up ,read the description of the dog ,used to be used as a dog to guard prisoners,not as bad as Pitbull but not far from it.

Went and spoke with my Manager ,and told him I was refusing to deliver to this house and the reason and the fact the regular guy was happyish to deliver their.
If this dog got out it would not bite you it rip you to bits.

Manager said he would meet me on round and have a look at DOG for himself.Manager tried to deliver letter saw dog and backed off .Manager agreed with me ,and wrote this guy
a letter,result now a post box on side of house so dont have to go anywhere dog is.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

I just started with royal mail and have been doing my round for the past 3 weeks. There are 2 delivery points which are potentially quite dangerous, I feel.

One I do not even attempt a delivery because everytime the dog sees me, i just know it wants to go for me and only reason it doesnt is because there is a small gate in front of it. The damn thing follows me from the front garden to back as the property is a corner plot. The owner is an elderly woman who clearly has no control over it which leads me to believe that if it did attack me, there would be stopping it!

Anyway, another place I am uneasy to go to is this one where 3 dogs are behind this wooden gate. I do not know what breed they are but I have been warned one attacked a girl last year who did my round and bit her quite badly. I am trying to find out more but nobody seems to know much or maybe doesnt want to tell me?

Anyway, these dogs have such an acute hearing, that even when I creep they hear me and are banging rather violently against the gate which worries me into wondering how secure the gate actually is because of the force of the dogs, I have seen it shake quite loosely. They bark like mad and growl, its gotten to point I dread going there and want to quit the job as there seems to be alot of dogs on this walk.

I have told my manager but he reckons they cannot act until I am bitten and even then it seems like nothing much will be done. Does anyone else think its unfair that have to wait to be bitten badly until something can be done? If we feel threatened why shouldnt we be allowed to defend ourselves??? If royal mail say our health and safety is paramount, then why do they allow posties to deliver to dangerous areas. Surely, we are more important than some mangy dog!!!
What would happen if I were to get bitten badly?

Royal Mail policy is that if you personally feel threatened by any animal then you are not legally obliged to put yourself at risk. On my walk I have 3 dogs at one house, 2 dogs at a 2nd, and about 10 - 15 houses where I know dogs reside so I am careful when entering their property.

ALWAYS check the garden/property out and if ANY dog is running free or can get access to you even if chained up DO NOT ENTER. Try to alert the residents, by calling out, but if unsuccessful then continue with your duty.

ALL letter/packets for addresses with loose dogs that you have been unable to deliver should be endorsed "Dog Loose" dated and pouched off or returned to the DO. You should also inform your Lineo (in your case with a rep/senior postie as a witness) as soon as you are able to.

My Lineo also says that they can only suspend deliveries when you have been attacked or there is a near miss, this may indeed be correct but they cannot ask you to risk your self just to deliver mail. Ultimately the risk is yours to take and if you don't want to then don't.

One last thing RM do have dog attack sprays which work and you can ask your DOM for them. Or you can purchase yourself sonic alarms that stop the dogs in their tracks. One I have heard of is called Dog Tazer despite its name it is a harmless sonic one.

[brothermagrew]

The pertinent parts as defined in Royal Mail Policy On Dealing With Dog Attacks is:

3. Policy Purpose and Objectives

Sub-para 3.4
Delivery staff and other staff working outdoors understand that they are under no obligation to collect or deliver mail to an address where they feel threatened by a dog at large and that every attack or incident of menacing must be reported to management.

Sub-para 3.5
All reported attacks or incidents of menacing will be entered on a local "Hazard Card", "Walk Log" and in the "Dog Attack Incident Sheet", or equivalet, for the information of other Postmen and Postwomen.

Sub-para 3.6
In all reported incidents of menacing and attack, where the owner is known, the Line Manager will suspend delivery/collection unless good reason exists not to, e.g. dog secured indoors.

In total there are some 12 sub-paragraphs which Line Managers will ensure that:

As I have intimated on another thread, anyone who is in doubt should be politely asking their individual line manager or DOM for a look at the Dealing with Dog Attacks - Good Practice Guide, which does contain Royal Mail's Policy On Dealing With Dog Attacks, and read it in full for themselves to become better educated on dog related aspects. Plus it also will give you a better inclintion of just what Royal Mail as a business requires and expects from their managers.

And if as I suspect where some linos or DOMs refuse a polite request from an employee, then I would be raising questions at WTL Sessions (Team Briefings) and asking for one why the refusal, and why have you as a manager never given their members of staff proper training and instruction in matters pertaining to dogs as detailed in the Dealing with Dog Attacks - Good Practice Guide and in Royal Mail's Policy On Dealing With Dog Attacks.

Another alternative of choice, would be to seek knowledgeable guidance from your CWU WSR (Workplace Safety Rep) or CWU ASR (Area Safety Rep).

[97gaz]

One I have heard of is called Dog Tazer despite its name it is a harmless sonic one.

Yeh, I had one called a Fazer. Didn't work though. Ended up throwing it at the dog.

Well, how was I supposed to know the bloody dog was deaf? Lol

It does work on most dogs though and as said, quite harmless.