How do I lose my Stage 1?

Ralph Wiggum · Post by **Ralph Wiggum** » 25 Nov 2008, 16:42

Hi all. Just joined, great site

Quick question, I got a 1st stage warning in June this year. How long till this is wiped off and back to a clean slate?

Thank-you

k979aaa · Post by **k979aaa** » 25 Nov 2008, 16:47

Ralph Wiggum wrote:Hi all. Just joined, great site

Quick question, I got a 1st stage warning in June this year. How long till this is wiped off and back to a clean slate?

Thank-you

Normaly 12 months but it depend's upon your contract and when you started and how many time's or day's off you have in the trial period.

Ralph Wiggum · Post by **Ralph Wiggum** » 25 Nov 2008, 16:52

worked full time for 4years, this is my first warning...

So I cant be off sick again until June 2009!???

oggie · Post by **oggie** » 25 Nov 2008, 17:09

as long as you do not exceed 2 periods but there must be at least 6 months between them, amounting to no more than 9 days in total in the 12 months from the issue date of the stage 1 you will be ok, the stage 1 will end after the 12 months.

Ralph Wiggum · Post by **Ralph Wiggum** » 25 Nov 2008, 17:13

Ok, thanks for that

luddite · Post by **luddite** » 25 Nov 2008, 17:15

Has anyone appealed against a stage 1? I understand that another manager hears the case, do you get a fair chance?

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 25 Nov 2008, 17:20

canolman wrote:Has anyone appealed against a stage 1? I understand that another manager hears the case, do you get a fair chance?

You can't appeal a stage 1 but you can put in a grievance against the Manager who issued it if you have a case. This is heard by a manager not involved in the original complaint and it would depend on that manager whether you got a fair hearing or not. However, even if you don't feel you will get a fair hearing you have to exhaust all Royal Mail grievance procedures before you can go to an Employment Hearing.

oggie · Post by **oggie** » 25 Nov 2008, 17:21

there is no appeal against a stage 1 or 2 just the rtu, always take a union rep in with you.

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 25 Nov 2008, 17:22

Ralph Wiggum wrote:worked full time for 4years, this is my first warning...

So I cant be off sick again until June 2009!???

No the attendance procedure for stages says:

2. MINIMUM NATIONAL ATTENDANCE STANDARDS - EMPLOYEES NOT ON TRIAL
Employees who have successfully completed their trial period are still required to maintain a high standard of attendance. Attendance may be regarded as warranting formal action if an employee who is not on trial has:

Stage 1: 4 absences or 14 days in a 12 month period
Stage 2: 2 absences or 10 days in any 6 month period during the next 12 months
Stage 3: 2 absences or 10 days in any 6 month period during the next 12 months
In deciding whether these standards are met for employees whose trial was recently confirmed, attendance during the whole of employment is considered, not jut from the date trial is confirmed. An employee whose trial has been confirmed following an improvement to the required triallist standard will be put back to the previous stage of the Attendance Procedure but the criteria appropriate to a non-triallist will then apply.

The full procedure is available at http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... 36&t=11808

johnnyp · Post by **johnnyp** » 25 Nov 2008, 17:22

oggie wrote:there is no appeal against a stage 1 or 2 just the rtu, always take a union rep in with you.

Correct and very good advice mate

luddite · Post by **luddite** » 25 Nov 2008, 17:26

I've just got a 12 month reprimand, it states at the end of the letter that I can appeal if I do not agree with the decision which I have in writing. Is this different to a first stage?

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 25 Nov 2008, 17:29

canolman wrote:I've just got a 12 month reprimand, it states at the end of the letter that I can appeal if I do not agree with the decision which I have in writing. Is this different to a first stage?

Yes you have received a 12 month serious for something and this as far as I know is appealable. Take your rep and get legal advice where possible.

http://www.cwu.org.uk/default.asp?step= ... ]Suspended dismissal - the period should be clearly specified in the range of 3 months to 2 years, with it clearly set out that any further serious breach of the Conduct Code during that time could automatically result in dismissal. The normal procedures would apply in establishing whether any further breach had occurred, and the individual would be given clear notice in the subsequent call to a discipline hearing that dismissal was a possibility[/quote]

http://www.cwu.org.uk/default.asp?step=4&pid=12

15 APPEAL PROCEDURE
Every employee has the right to appeal against a discipline penalty. If the employee wishes to appeal, he/she should tell the manager who imposed the penalty within 3 working days of written notification of the penalty. Individuals will be encouraged to state their grounds for appeal. A hearing will then be arranged within 2 weeks (up to serious warning)5or within 4 weeks (for major penalties) and the employee will be notified in writing of the time, place and manager dealing with the appeal at least 5 working days beforehand.
If the employee appeals against a discipline penalty he/she can be accompanied by their relevant union representative or a colleague from the same work location who may assist him/her to present his/her case. At the hearing the employee will be expected to present his/her case.

The appeal is a hearing at which the appropriate appeal manager will rehear the case in its entirety. It is the employee's opportunity to state his/her case why the penalty should be set aside or reduced. The result could be revoking or confirming the decision, or reducing the penalty.

For appeals against Reprimands or Serious Warnings the appeal will be held out of line (or for geographical reasons at an adjacent unit) at the next level of authority to where the decision was made.

Appeals against Major Offences (action short of dismissal or dismissal) will be held by an Appeals Manager normally at an appropriate main unit within the Area.

In some cases further investigation will be required in which case the hearing may be adjourned by the Appeals Manager. The employee will be made fully aware of any relevant new evidence and given sufficient time to consider it with his/her representative.

The employee will normally be told the outcome of the appeal face to face within 5 working days. If this is not possible the individual will be informed of the reason and the expected delay.

In all cases the employee will receive a written notification of the decision, with the reasons for it.

If management is unable to arrange an appeal in a reasonable time, an offer extending the notice period may be made, at management's discretion. In the event of a successful appeal and consequential reinstatement then continuity of employment will be preserved.