ANNOUNCEMENT : ALL OF ROYAL MAIL'S EMPLOYMENT POLICIES (AGREEMENTS) AT A GLANCE (Updated 2021)... HERE

ANNOUNCEMENT : PLEASE BE AWARE WE ARE NOT ON FACEBOOK AT ALL!

Disregarding equality act

Got a question for a CWU Rep? And all CWU related matters.
Cobblers_3
Posts: 26
Joined: 27 Apr 2013, 13:31
Gender: Male

Disregarding equality act

Post by Cobblers_3 »

I’m a very big sufferer of severe anxiety and panic attacks, it’s something I battle with daily in and out of work. It leads to depression in worst cases.
Sometimes it will lead to me not being able to leave the house. OH covered me under the equality act several years ago, but I’ve just had notice that ‘future absences due to “my disability” will count towards a stage as the company count my attendance unacceptable’
Whilst I know some will disagree with people who suffer with these things like myself as I’m aware some people play fast and loose with the illness, is it fair or legal for them to disregard the equality act? Such acts are there for a reason. Any help appreciated as all it’s done is highlighted my anxiety!
Jb1969
Posts: 387
Joined: 29 May 2014, 13:06
Gender: Male

Re: Disregarding equality act

Post by Jb1969 »

This topic has come up a little while ago.
Woody argued that under the Equality Act it states a “reasonable” amount of time off should be aloud under this act.
I was sceptical to say the least, but after doing my own research he has been proved correct.
I’m not sure what “reasonable” means in terms of time off, both from an Employee & RM.
That would be up to a Judge to decide but ultimately they would take an extremely dim view with regards sacking someone under this act.
Even when issuing attendance reviews the Managers are given options of “Issued” or “Issued under the DDA”now.
Not sure where this is going, perhaps someone with a greater insight into RM new policies would care to elaborate, Woody?
noggin1969
Posts: 1321
Joined: 13 Oct 2009, 17:28
Gender: Male

Re: Disregarding equality act

Post by noggin1969 »

aiden01
MAIL CENTRES/PROCESSING
Posts: 7001
Joined: 27 Feb 2013, 21:43
Gender: Male

Re: Disregarding equality act

Post by aiden01 »

Jb1969 wrote:
27 Sep 2023, 19:24
This topic has come up a little while ago.
Woody argued that under the Equality Act it states a “reasonable” amount of time off should be aloud under this act.
I was sceptical to say the least, but after doing my own research he has been proved correct.
I’m not sure what “reasonable” means in terms of time off, both from an Employee & RM.
That would be up to a Judge to decide but ultimately they would take an extremely dim view with regards sacking someone under this act.
Even when issuing attendance reviews the Managers are given options of “Issued” or “Issued under the DDA”now.
Not sure where this is going, perhaps someone with a greater insight into RM new policies would care to elaborate, Woody?
Not sure if rm policies supersede the equality act.could well be a million miles out tho.
Jb1969
Posts: 387
Joined: 29 May 2014, 13:06
Gender: Male

Re: Disregarding equality act

Post by Jb1969 »

aiden01 wrote:
27 Sep 2023, 22:13
Jb1969 wrote:
27 Sep 2023, 19:24
This topic has come up a little while ago.
Woody argued that under the Equality Act it states a “reasonable” amount of time off should be aloud under this act.
I was sceptical to say the least, but after doing my own research he has been proved correct.
I’m not sure what “reasonable” means in terms of time off, both from an Employee & RM.
That would be up to a Judge to decide but ultimately they would take an extremely dim view with regards sacking someone under this act.
Even when issuing attendance reviews the Managers are given options of “Issued” or “Issued under the DDA”now.
Not sure where this is going, perhaps someone with a greater insight into RM new policies would care to elaborate, Woody?
Not sure if rm policies supersede the equality act.could well be a million miles out tho.
Completely agree Aiden, but since RM are consistently breaking the USO & any agreements with the CWU & the decision making processes are becoming more bizarre by the day who knows what road they are currently taking.
Another bluff to increase the pressure felt by those already suffering, I would not put it past them!
aiden01
MAIL CENTRES/PROCESSING
Posts: 7001
Joined: 27 Feb 2013, 21:43
Gender: Male

Re: Disregarding equality act

Post by aiden01 »

Jb1969 wrote:
27 Sep 2023, 22:34
aiden01 wrote:
27 Sep 2023, 22:13
Jb1969 wrote:
27 Sep 2023, 19:24
This topic has come up a little while ago.
Woody argued that under the Equality Act it states a “reasonable” amount of time off should be aloud under this act.
I was sceptical to say the least, but after doing my own research he has been proved correct.
I’m not sure what “reasonable” means in terms of time off, both from an Employee & RM.
That would be up to a Judge to decide but ultimately they would take an extremely dim view with regards sacking someone under this act.
Even when issuing attendance reviews the Managers are given options of “Issued” or “Issued under the DDA”now.
Not sure where this is going, perhaps someone with a greater insight into RM new policies would care to elaborate, Woody?
Not sure if rm policies supersede the equality act.could well be a million miles out tho.
Completely agree Aiden, but since RM are consistently breaking the USO & any agreements with the CWU & the decision making processes are becoming more bizarre by the day who knows what road they are currently taking.
Another bluff to increase the pressure felt by those already suffering, I would not put it past them!
Neither would i mate.
User avatar
Basildon Bond
Posts: 410
Joined: 21 Dec 2022, 19:21
Gender: Male

Re: Disregarding equality act

Post by Basildon Bond »

Cobblers_3 wrote:
27 Sep 2023, 17:39
I’m a very big sufferer of severe anxiety and panic attacks, it’s something I battle with daily in and out of work. It leads to depression in worst cases.
Sometimes it will lead to me not being able to leave the house. OH covered me under the equality act several years ago, but I’ve just had notice that ‘future absences due to “my disability” will count towards a stage as the company count my attendance unacceptable’
Whilst I know some will disagree with people who suffer with these things like myself as I’m aware some people play fast and loose with the illness, is it fair or legal for them to disregard the equality act? Such acts are there for a reason. Any help appreciated as all it’s done is highlighted my anxiety!
I'm not speaking from the outside on this. My late father suffered from anxiety and I also suffered from it too. It's not something easily explained to someone who has not experienced it themself.

From my own research there are protections. The short answer - from my understanding - is that you cannot be sacked immediately for a mental health issue like anxiety without RM being liable for disability discrimination. However, you can ultimately be sacked.

Hard and tough reality is that any company (RM, Tesco, Pete's Plumbing & Co Ltd, etc.) has to jump through a few hoops and then they can dismiss an employee. The company has to first be made aware of the illness - otherwise they can claim ignorance. Then the company has to look at a few options: changing your work (shift pattern or times, what you do exactly) and see if that helps both sides; also look at any additional "equipment" that needs to be provided (I recall a company adding a punching bag and a set of gloves to the office and anyone getting stressed was advised to go and spend a few minutes swinging all they had at it and it kind of worked); then finally adjusting general sickness policies to allow a bit more time off.

If all of these steps have been done and an employee is still unable to perform their job you can be dismissed. Again, I speak from the inside on this, but if anyone is say in bed curled up in the foetal position for four days out of seven then you cannot do a job and have to look at leaving.

On the flip side you should look at "fixing" the problem. Simple to say but much harder to do. Get help for the anxiety. There may have to be a lot of looking into yourself as to what causes the anxiety. Recognise the triggers and work on removing them. I'm not a believer but I do like the Serenity Prayer: grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference. Or in other words and being blunt develop a "fu*k it" attitude. By that I mean pick your battles and otherwise develop the ability to let everything wash over and round you without affecting you - it's a real skill.

I remember, years ago now, how I always really liked to look my best at all times. Properly dressed and turned out etc. However, I remember, when my nephews were young how I was happily chatting to a couple of dads in a park and I was standing there covered in dirty and had vanilla ice cream smeared across my shoulder of a shirt I really liked from holding the littler one while he enjoyed an ice cream earlier - I really didn't care as I was too tired. But I was content nonetheless.

I also remember when I watched the late Bill Hicks and his bit about "It's Just A Ride" (life that is). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgzQuE1pR1w

Equally you could talk to your doctor. There are pills to take the edge off the stress. Maybe one Tramadol 50mg after breakfast for a while would help (https://www.drugs.com/comments/tramadol ... xiety.html).

Good luck!
redlen
Posts: 1341
Joined: 21 Dec 2021, 12:05
Gender: Male

Re: Disregarding equality act

Post by redlen »

Many things to consider.

To start off, will be blunt. Royal Mail is not a charity but a commercial business.

Is the time off sick with full pay been excessive previously?
What is the future prognosis of your illness?
Has the employer accommodated your illness to the best of their ability previously, with reasonable adjustments and no improvement?
What does the Occupational Health report say of your illness?

Royal Mail can dismiss you under capability if their reasoning is fair and proportionate.

The Equality Act/DDA is not a magic bullet but gives you the same rights not to be discriminated against compared to an able-bodied employee and the absence policy.