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Members update

Pay talks 2022 discussion, news, LTB's RMCtv and all BUSINESS RECOVERY, TRANSFORMATION AND GROWTH AGREEMENT chat
Martin Walsh
Posts: 4272
Joined: 19 Sep 2007, 20:12
Location: neverland

Members update

Post by Martin Walsh »

🚨Urgent 🚨
Can you please circulate to all your what’s app groups , reps and members :

London Calling Update. Joint Statement reached to allow intensive negotiations :

Dear Colleague

Royal Mail and CWU have agreed a Joint Statement which confirms that there will be a period of intensive negotiations on all aspects of our dispute over pay and change.

The aim of both parties is to try and reach and an agreement on all aspects of our dispute. This includes the so called final pay and change offer they made earlier this week.

This also includes the 10 thousand job cuts which Royal Mail announced and the threat of compulsory redundancies.

For the first time the CEO Simon Thompson has signed the joint statement stating he will personally lead the negotiations on behalf of Royal Mail. The negotiations will take place with the involvement of ACAS.

Royal Mail’s quarterly finance results will be announced on 17th November and clearly this is huge pressure on Royal Mail to try and resolve the dispute. Remember shareholders and potential investors want to make money not be embroiled in lengthy disputes.

To create the right climate for these negotiations, Royal Mail have agreed to pause the one to one interviews they were going to carry out in Deliveries and Parcelforce on redundancies . Remember in Deliveries they were going ask whether you wanted to leave Royal Mail by redundancy due to your local revision and then design the revision by the numbers who want redundancy.

However it would also appear that Royal Mail senior managers have told the COMs to still have one to ones with staff on your units new start times , any allowances you have , the new terms of sick pay and Royal Mail’s proposed season variations. It is essential that members know that all of the above is subject to further negotiations and therefore the unions strong advice is do not attend any one to one meetings with your COMs on unagreed changes.

Royal Mail have also agreed that subject to work load that normal overtime will be offered. Royal Mail have also said they will takes steps to deescalate the tensions in offices to create the right environment for negotiations over the next ten days.

The CWU have got some fundamental red lines which clearly we will hold our ground on and that is no compulsory redundancies, no new owner drivers and no to the creation of a cheaper workforce competing for work with the existing workforce.

The CWU know the strength of feelings over Sundays , later starts , sick leave and annualised hours.

We do believe that we can find acceptable solutions to most of what Royal Mail’s change program providing they are willing to compromise too.

If Royal Mail are then it may be possible for our CWU negotiators to reach an acceptable agreement by the 15th November. Remember any agreement will be subject to an individual member ballot.

However if the negotiations fail and Royal Mail are not prepared to move on the key issues then we will continue to take strike action.

Remember we have not stood down any action on the basis of these intensive negotiations.

Therefore the two 48 hours strikes covering the Black Friday week and Cyber Monday weeks are still on.

The Postal Executive have also provisionally agreed a hard hitting program of action from the 3rd December up to Christmas Eve. This will be announced if talks fail.

In every dispute there has to come a time when both parties create the space for intensive negotiations to resolve the dispute. The next ten days is this opportunity. Unfortunately it will not be possible or helpful to give reps and members a running commentary on the intensive negotiations. In fact ACAS will want a period of radio silence to assist the negotiations. The CWU will update you when there is something to say.

However whilst the CWU hope for the best we must also prepare for the worst. Therefore gate meetings will continue throughout London.

The important message is your solidarity in standing together and striking has forced Royal Mail into these negotiations.

Remember if we continue to stand firm Royal Mail will have no other option but to reach an acceptable pay and change agreement.

We will update you further in due course.

Thank you for your United and unwavering support.

A statement by the London Divisional Committee
Dorset Plodder
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Joined: 29 Apr 2009, 20:05
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by Dorset Plodder »

:thumbup At least that sounds more positive than previous meetings. Maybe that's why our COM dished out a Branch Specific letter covering those unagreed changes to everyone returning from duty on Friday Afternoon (along with a quick pep talk) hoping to get in with the BS before the Cease -Fire? :cuppa
Like all Wage Slaves, he had two crosses to bear: The people he worked for and the people he worked with! (Stephen Vizinczey.)
theotherone
Posts: 430
Joined: 04 Jun 2020, 21:58
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by theotherone »

Martin.Just a quick question,as it stands the pay offer from RM still is on the table.Will we still be voting on that an the no confidence on ST? I guess that means it's off the table now,or?
Yumyum
Posts: 27
Joined: 28 Mar 2014, 13:16
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by Yumyum »

Martin thanks for the update but from what I have read,, a peice in the FT said that the cwu have paused/cancelled both the 48 hour strikes for the 24/25 and 30/1 to allow for both sides to de-escalate tension and allow constructive talks. Now either that statement is untrue or the union is lying to its members. I guess we will find out soon when you have to give the 2 weeks notice to RM,, which you haven't done yet. I really hope that isn't the case as I'm afraid ST is playing the union again
Clappedoutpostie
Posts: 1260
Joined: 05 Nov 2021, 21:46
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by Clappedoutpostie »

Yumyum wrote:
06 Nov 2022, 12:46
Martin thanks for the update but from what I have read,, a peice in the FT said that the cwu have paused/cancelled both the 48 hour strikes for the 24/25 and 30/1 to allow for both sides to de-escalate tension and allow constructive talks. Now either that statement is untrue or the union is lying to its members. I guess we will find out soon when you have to give the 2 weeks notice to RM,, which you haven't done yet. I really hope that isn't the case as I'm afraid ST is playing the union again
I’m sure the CWU negotiators will have a feel for how things are going to go by Thursday (10th) when 14 days notice is required. I would also assume RM are aware of the proposed strike action in December hence their desire to get back in the room.
Martin Walsh
Posts: 4272
Joined: 19 Sep 2007, 20:12
Location: neverland

Re: Members update

Post by Martin Walsh »

I have not seen the FT article but I can guarantee you that the Postal Executive decision to announce the 24,25 ,30 November and 1st December are still on and we have to serve the legal notice for 24th on 10th November.

In terms of views about ST playing us , we all have an opinion but what if the board and key shareholders had gone along with Thompson plans believing that members and union would be broken.

Now those same board members and key shareholders are saying when is this dispute going to be settled as uncertainty is never good in business.

So maybe ST wants to announce on 17th November half year results they there is an agreement with the CWU and the dispute is resolved and that the agreement will help turn around the company finances.

In terms of the question is the consultative ball Still on ? No it has been paused as the Royal Mail offer is now subject to further negotiations.
PFdriver488
PARCELFORCE
Posts: 37
Joined: 29 Mar 2022, 21:57
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by PFdriver488 »

Martin Walsh wrote:
06 Nov 2022, 14:22
I have not seen the FT article but I can guarantee you that the Postal Executive decision to announce the 24,25 ,30 November and 1st December are still on and we have to serve the legal notice for 24th on 10th November.

In terms of views about ST playing us , we all have an opinion but what if the board and key shareholders had gone along with Thompson plans believing that members and union would be broken.

Now those same board members and key shareholders are saying when is this dispute going to be settled as uncertainty is never good in business.

So maybe ST wants to announce on 17th November half year results they there is an agreement with the CWU and the dispute is resolved and that the agreement will help turn around the company finances.

In terms of the question is the consultative ball Still on ? No it has been paused as the Royal Mail offer is now subject to further negotiations.
U mean the members ballot and vote of no confidence by us is not happening this week then?
Acca Dacca
Posts: 3212
Joined: 16 Aug 2009, 17:13
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by Acca Dacca »

Martin Walsh wrote:
06 Nov 2022, 14:22


So maybe ST wants to announce on 17th November half year results they there is an agreement with the CWU and the dispute is resolved and that the agreement will help turn around the company finances.
Is it realistic for there to be an agreement finalised by the 17th given thats 11 days away and the membership would still need to be balloted on it?
If you tolerate this, then your paid break will be next
yellowbelly
Posts: 3713
Joined: 23 Jun 2015, 15:51
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by yellowbelly »

Acca Dacca wrote:
06 Nov 2022, 14:40
Martin Walsh wrote:
06 Nov 2022, 14:22


So maybe ST wants to announce on 17th November half year results they there is an agreement with the CWU and the dispute is resolved and that the agreement will help turn around the company finances.
Is it realistic for there to be an agreement finalised by the 17th given thats 11 days away and the membership would still need to be balloted on it?
I can see a scenario where a deal is agreed before the 17th and recommended to accept by CWU negotiators as another 'Deal of the Century'
'It's the best we're going to get' even if it can't be put before the membership to vote on by 17th. That way Si gets to give the good
news to the shareholders. And if then the membership was to subsequently reject it in a vote then where does that leave us? Up s**t creek!
Woody Guthrie
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Re: Members update

Post by Woody Guthrie »

The CWU have got some fundamental red lines which clearly we will hold our ground on and that is no compulsory redundancies, no new owner drivers and no to the creation of a cheaper workforce competing for work with the existing workforce.
What happened to all those original red lines Martin?
We both know this dispute is over so what are we doing now? Just polishing the turd that is Simon's deal until the 15th?

You owe the membership and the local reps big time for this one, they have saved the CWU as well as defending their own terms and conditions, if this deal looks anything like Simon's insulting offer it might be time to get out of Dodge.

There better not be annualised hours.
There better not be flexi-hours.
There better not be bench merging.
There better not be commit to deliver.
There better not be performance "management".
Never mind acceptable solutions, these are unacceptable in any form.

Oh and if they don't find more money from somewhere you can forget it.
The members didn't take 8 days of strike action for a paltry 3.5% extra not even backdated, a one off bonus they might never see and a quite frankly f***ing insulting 1.5% for next year.
Only dead fish follow the current
yellowbelly
Posts: 3713
Joined: 23 Jun 2015, 15:51
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by yellowbelly »

Woody Guthrie wrote:
06 Nov 2022, 15:43

There better not be annualised hours.
There better not be flexi-hours.
There better not be bench merging.
There better not be commit to deliver.
There better not be performance "management".
Never mind acceptable solutions, these are unacceptable in any form.
There better not be compulsory Sundays - without having the Saturday off - GUARANTEED.
Woody Guthrie
Posts: 5166
Joined: 29 Sep 2018, 20:47
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by Woody Guthrie »

There better not be compulsory Sundays
There never was going to be compulsory Sundays.
You can't enforce Sunday working, it has to be agreed.
Only dead fish follow the current
Acca Dacca
Posts: 3212
Joined: 16 Aug 2009, 17:13
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by Acca Dacca »

Woody Guthrie wrote:
06 Nov 2022, 15:52
There better not be compulsory Sundays
There never was going to be compulsory Sundays.
You can't enforce Sunday working, it has to be agreed.
Can it be agreed collectively though?
If you tolerate this, then your paid break will be next
theotherone
Posts: 430
Joined: 04 Jun 2020, 21:58
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by theotherone »

Woody Guthrie wrote:
06 Nov 2022, 15:43
The CWU have got some fundamental red lines which clearly we will hold our ground on and that is no compulsory redundancies, no new owner drivers and no to the creation of a cheaper workforce competing for work with the existing workforce.
What happened to all those original red lines Martin?
We both know this dispute is over so what are we doing now? Just polishing the turd that is Simon's deal until the 15th?

You owe the membership and the local reps big time for this one, they have saved the CWU as well as defending their own terms and conditions, if this deal looks anything like Simon's insulting offer it might be time to get out of Dodge.

There better not be annualised hours.
There better not be flexi-hours.
There better not be bench merging.
There better not be commit to deliver.
There better not be performance "management".
Never mind acceptable solutions, these are unacceptable in any form.

Oh and if they don't find more money from somewhere you can forget it.
The members didn't take 8 days of strike action for a paltry 3.5% extra not even backdated, a one off bonus they might never see and a quite frankly f***ing insulting 1.5% for next year.
The pay has to be backdated I wouldn't vote on another offer without back-pay.What kind of message does it give out otherwise? The RM can drag out any pay dispute for however long and thats fine and we have to accept that? RM have probably saved themselves anywhere from £250m up so far getting out of an inflation based payrise in April.
Woody Guthrie
Posts: 5166
Joined: 29 Sep 2018, 20:47
Gender: Male

Re: Members update

Post by Woody Guthrie »

Acca Dacca wrote:
06 Nov 2022, 15:58
Woody Guthrie wrote:
06 Nov 2022, 15:52
There better not be compulsory Sundays
There never was going to be compulsory Sundays.
You can't enforce Sunday working, it has to be agreed.
Can it be agreed collectively though?
Of course.
If the union were suicidal.
Only dead fish follow the current