Royal Mail's losses are worsening and the union should start talks

[grchpo]

Losing £365 million, paid out £400 million, not hard to work out where all the profit has gone.

[chrisj]

https://www.theguardian.com/business/ni ... on-to-acas


But the CWU’s leaders would be wise to reflect on a few financial realities. First, Royal Mail is definitely in a deep and deepening financial hole. It has been bizarre in recent weeks to hear Dave Ward, the general secretary of the union, question Royal Mail’s claim to be losing £1m a day. [/b]Quoted companies do not pluck numbers out of thin air in their stock market statements, or not usually. In fact, Friday’s statement showed the position to be even worse: the six-month loss was £219m.

The financial illiteracy is staggering! It goes to show we are led by donkeys and their influence is pervasive - utter rubbish and conspiracy theories without educating themselves.

RM asked them to look at the books - a privilege not easily given because it is market sensitive; all they could come up with is that it is some financial hocus-pocus - ignoramuses!

Their assertion has found a real home with folks or members that simply want to stick fingers in their ears and heads in the sand.

[k979aaa]

Losing £365 million, paid out £400 million, not hard to work out where all the profit has gone.

Royal Mail paid out more the £400 million you and I know that we have to hold these people to account for their actions!

[k979aaa]

And someone believes the newspapers well when they are not charging us for common knowledge they install cookies and malware on your devices. What a great nation we live in they will tell you anything they want you to hear and nothing you should be told about!

[TopperGas]

Losing £365 million, paid out £400 million, not hard to work out where all the profit has gone.

What's so hard to understand? The £400m was paid out of last year's profits, the £365 loss is what RM have, apparently, lost so far this year, we all need to move on from last year's dividend payout as RM aren't going to give us now what they've already given out to shareholders.

If DW keeps making the same point no wonder talks are, seemingly, going nowhere fast.

[chrisj]

Also why is it so hard to believe that a delivery company is making a loss given the increased energy prices and the letter part of the company not being that profitable because of the USO?

I give up now talking about the money given to shareholders - it is just not worth going on about it... Our folks expect the shareholders to get nothing from their investments - I don't get it! The shareholders did not even get a dividend the year before...

Perhaps it was too generous and lacked foresight but it is gone. The bonuses are not called for, especially the latest bonuses but it could also be based on last year's profits and performance. Done!

However, it does not change the loss we are currently making; even before the strikes.

* My last on this!

[Schiff]

Also why is it so hard to believe that a delivery company is making a loss given the increased energy prices

It doesn't matter that RM are making a loss. The going rate for labour has increased in the same way that the going rate for gas, electricity, diesel etc has increased. They can't expect not to pay the going rate. They should be going to OFCOM demanding a significant rise in the cost of stamps if the current price doesn't cover the actual costs involved.

RM are going to make a much bigger loss if, by not paying their increased bills (including the increased wage bill) they are unable to provide a reliable service. You seem to think that I should care about whether RM continues to thrive as a business. I don't. That is for those who have invested in RM to worry about. My concern is that they pay me the appropriate amount for my labour. If they want to renegotiate that contract for my labour so that I am faced with worse terms and conditions of employment then the price of my labour goes up significantly more.

[Caesar]

They should be going to OFCOM demanding a significant rise in the cost of stamps if the current price doesn't cover the actual costs involved.

Or, more likely demanding a reduction in the uso.

[aiden01]

Also why is it so hard to believe that a delivery company is making a loss given the increased energy prices and the letter part of the company not being that profitable because of the USO?

I give up now talking about the money given to shareholders - it is just not worth going on about it... Our folks expect the shareholders to get nothing from their investments - I don't get it! The shareholders did not even get a dividend the year before...

Perhaps it was too generous and lacked foresight but it is gone. The bonuses are not called for, especially the latest bonuses but it could also be based on last year's profits and performance. Done!

However, it does not change the loss we are currently making; even before the strikes.

* My last on this!

Your on my foe list thank god just had a sneak to see what crap your still posting an see nothing has changed

[britwrit]

Also why is it so hard to believe that a delivery company is making a loss given the increased energy prices

It doesn't matter that RM are making a loss. The going rate for labour has increased in the same way that the going rate for gas, electricity, diesel etc has increased. They can't expect not to pay the going rate. They should be going to OFCOM demanding a significant rise in the cost of stamps if the current price doesn't cover the actual costs involved.

RM are going to make a much bigger loss if, by not paying their increased bills (including the increased wage bill) they are unable to provide a reliable service. You seem to think that I should care about whether RM continues to thrive as a business. I don't. That is for those who have invested in RM to worry about. My concern is that they pay me the appropriate amount for my labour. If they want to renegotiate that contract for my labour so that I am faced with worse terms and conditions of employment then the price of my labour goes up significantly more.

I know. It's like they've gone to war against the free market as well as the union.

[Flashman_]

Also why is it so hard to believe that a delivery company is making a loss given the increased energy prices

It doesn't matter that RM are making a loss. The going rate for labour has increased in the same way that the going rate for gas, electricity, diesel etc has increased. They can't expect not to pay the going rate. They should be going to OFCOM demanding a significant rise in the cost of stamps if the current price doesn't cover the actual costs involved.

RM are going to make a much bigger loss if, by not paying their increased bills (including the increased wage bill) they are unable to provide a reliable service. You seem to think that I should care about whether RM continues to thrive as a business. I don't. That is for those who have invested in RM to worry about. My concern is that they pay me the appropriate amount for my labour. If they want to renegotiate that contract for my labour so that I am faced with worse terms and conditions of employment then the price of my labour goes up significantly more.

Spot on, You would not ask a plumber to take less for a job because you plead poverty so, why are they asking us to accept less than the new market rate. We have to pay to buy food at the market price, so they should expect to do the same. End of argument!

[Ppat98]

Losing £365 million, paid out £400 million, not hard to work out where all the profit has gone.

What's so hard to understand? The £400m was paid out of last year's profits, the £365 loss is what RM have, apparently, lost so far this year, we all need to move on from last year's dividend payout as RM aren't going to give us now what they've already given out to shareholders.

If DW keeps making the same point no wonder talks are, seemingly, going nowhere fast.

Nice to read a fair & rational statement made. Alot on hear seem to think Rm can keep those covid profits up into infinity. Many businesses boomed during covid because people were locked down & ordered like no other time in history but those companies are now in downturn. Ocado, Halfords, Wickes. etc etc. So why is it so hard for the Homer's to believe rm isn't suffering too.
We will see what they will say in April when the end of year financial statement is published. Guessing the simpletons will claim the number's are made up
Rm are no doubt playing hardball but there's no way that they are doing aswell as the recent past.
The threat of firing 10,000 might be a desperate ploy to slow down strikes & they could fold & give in to the CWU before Christmas or they could genuinely be going through financial difficultly. Guess we will have to wait & find out.

[Drezlar]

The simpletons? Nice one mate. If you believe what the company is telling you in the face of all previous and current evidence to the contrary, then I don't know what to tell you. There are no kind words for what that makes you, Chrisj, Twoyearpostie and the like who post here constantly on the side of the bosses so I won't use any words at all.

We've heard these figures for years. Every single time IA is on the cards, or happening, Royal Mail put out a statement that they're losing a million a day. Always the same amount, a million per day. A million is a lot less these days than in the 70's when they were saying exactly the same thing so maybe things aren't that bad after all. Bosses that are in charge of a company that's genuinely losing a million per day don't stay bosses for long. That's losing a million per day, not making a million less per day than they were last year which is probably the reality and not the same thing.

Like many have said here, the performance of the company, or lack of it, is not down to us posties. Quite the opposite, I and everyone at my DO have never worked harder or with less staff. We deserve to be fairly compensated for our labour and not have terms and conditions that we were hired under taken away. When you can go on Indeed and see jobs galore that are Mon-Fri 8-4 for more money than we're on you wonder what the hell our Leadership are doing wrong. I'm only still here because I'm in the middle of buying a house. I've got too many years left till retirement to have this crap every other year or so.

As for the 10,000 job cuts; It's an obviously empty threat to terrify us into dropping the strikes. The target date for those 10k cuts are August 2023. Thats basically a year from now. Natural Attrition at my last place of work, where such things were within my job role, ran at between 6 and 10%. Against a workforce of 100,000 ( there are more of us I think but I've never known the proper figure? ) that will add up to between 6k and 10k leavers. All they have to do is freeze recruitment and they'll hit that 10k target or near as dammit. Beyond that though, given that my DO has new starters coming this week, and only yesterday I was sent job alerts for Postperson with Driving roles from several other DO's in my area, it all just smells like total bullshit to me.

[richietns]

Losing £365 million, paid out £400 million, not hard to work out where all the profit has gone.

What's so hard to understand? The £400m was paid out of last year's profits, the £365 loss is what RM have, apparently, lost so far this year, we all need to move on from last year's dividend payout as RM aren't going to give us now what they've already given out to shareholders.

If DW keeps making the same point no wonder talks are, seemingly, going nowhere fast.

Nice to read a fair & rational statement made. Alot on hear seem to think Rm can keep those covid profits up into infinity. Many businesses boomed during covid because people were locked down & ordered like no other time in history but those companies are now in downturn. Ocado, Halfords, Wickes. etc etc. So why is it so hard for the Homer's to believe rm isn't suffering too.
We will see what they will say in April when the end of year financial statement is published. Guessing the simpletons will claim the number's are made up
Rm are no doubt playing hardball but there's no way that they are doing aswell as the recent past.
The threat of firing 10,000 might be a desperate ploy to slow down strikes & they could fold & give in to the CWU before Christmas or they could genuinely be going through financial difficultly. Guess we will have to wait & find out.

Rico tried the same thing and got sacked yet we got a rise linked to change,why can't the new ceo's sort something out you really think Simon cares about the company most posties will have this job for life so dont want terrible terms and conditions,people are sick every three year a new CEO comes in fails then trys to gig economy the job telling the staff work harder on shity terms,and why didn't they reinvest the covid profits you talked about.

[Ppat98]

The simpletons? Nice one mate. If you believe what the company is telling you in the face of all previous and current evidence to the contrary, then I don't know what to tell you. There are no kind words for what that makes you, Chrisj, Twoyearpostie and the like who post here constantly on the side of the bosses so I won't use any words at all.

We've heard these figures for years. Every single time IA is on the cards, or happening, Royal Mail put out a statement that they're losing a million a day. Always the same amount, a million per day. A million is a lot less these days than in the 70's when they were saying exactly the same thing so maybe things aren't that bad after all. Bosses that are in charge of a company that's genuinely losing a million per day don't stay bosses for long. That's losing a million per day, not making a million less per day than they were last year which is probably the reality and not the same thing.

Like many have said here, the performance of the company, or lack of it, is not down to us posties. Quite the opposite, I and everyone at my DO have never worked harder or with less staff. We deserve to be fairly compensated for our labour and not have terms and conditions that we were hired under taken away. When you can go on Indeed and see jobs galore that are Mon-Fri 8-4 for more money than we're on you wonder what the hell our Leadership are doing wrong. I'm only still here because I'm in the middle of buying a house. I've got too many years left till retirement to have this crap every other year or so.

As for the 10,000 job cuts; It's an obviously empty threat to terrify us into dropping the strikes. The target date for those 10k cuts are August 2023. Thats basically a year from now. Natural Attrition at my last place of work, where such things were within my job role, ran at between 6 and 10%. Against a workforce of 100,000 ( there are more of us I think but I've never known the proper figure? ) that will add up to between 6k and 10k leavers. All they have to do is freeze recruitment and they'll hit that 10k target or near as dammit. Beyond that though, given that my DO has new starters coming this week, and only yesterday I was sent job alerts for Postperson with Driving roles from several other DO's in my area, it all just smells like total bullshit to me.

I should of been more specific. I was talking about the £700+ million figure that people keep qouting & seem Rm can continue to do in upcoming years. To believe that is simplistic thinking.
The million pound a day lose I have no idea if it's bs or not. It could be a scare tactic or it could hold some weight. We will find out at the end of the financial year where Rm stands financially but as I said some people won't accept that either. The end of year financials can't be lied about as it would be fraudulent.
Even if we wasn't striking it wouldn't be hard to believe that they are losing money this year because the bubble has burst after covid, people are ordering less & add into it we are now in time's where many are struggling to afford non essentials.
I'm not condoning Simon's bully tactics. Him & the board are hellbent on doing things their way. We should continue striking until the end of the year & hopefully get somewhere. Just be realistic with where the business is at currently.