Social Distancing And Shops

Post by **SpacePhoenix** » 27 Apr 2020, 15:48

I've just been reading some of the proposed changes to get shops re-opened and frankly they're on the whole a load of bullshit as on the whole they're either impossible or impractical to implement:

* Separate entrances and exits: Only doable with a very few shops as apart from really big ones all shops tend to have a single combined entrance and exit
* Queueing 2m apart outside: Unless you've got 1 single shop in the road, impossible, you'd have the queues going right across the road to maintain the 2m distance
* One way systems: Viable in every type of shop, I don't think so
* Limiting the number of customers inside at a time: Not sure on this one, unless the 2m gap could be kept in the queue for that shop and from the queues from other shops, basically not practical
* Closing toilets in stores: That's going to push more people to buying stuff online and would it potentially fall foul of disability regs?
* Closing changing rooms in clothes stores: They might as well not bother re-opening the clothes stores then as without people being able to try stuff on in-store they might as well order it on-line from the comfort of their own home and get it delivered to their own home, no worrying about parking, etc

They can't do away with cash payments unless they're going to guarantee that EVERYONE will have access to a current account and debit card

Oh, and while I'm thinking about it, how will the 2m rule work in schools, don't know about now but years ago when I went to school it was an average of 30 per class. For the 2m to be brought it, they'd need double the number of teachers and would probably have to double the number of classrooms, canteens etc if it were to be a long term thing.

Realistically there's only two options:

* Masks: make everyone wear a mask at all times when not at home
* Continued Lockdown: Keep the lockdown in place until a vaccine is available (and that's assuming there eventually is one - based on what I've read there's no guarantee that even those who've had it will be immune from re-infection

Woody Guthrie · Post by **Woody Guthrie** » 27 Apr 2020, 16:12

I think to be honest we're at the crossroads of whether non-essential physical retail outlets are even viable.

This pandemic has probably accelerated it to the point of no return for most. I certainly wouldn't be re-opening a small shop if I relied on a heavy footfall.

The viability of social distancing is a separate issue, I don't think the government's plans are to stop the spread of coronavirus, simply to slow it down to a manageable level. If you assume that then the social distancing measures do not have to be 100% successfull they just need to avoid another surge in cases.

The real key to that is testing and contact tracing. So far this government has failed miserably on that count.

danny2006 · Post by **danny2006** » 27 Apr 2020, 18:34

Don't know about other areas, but where I work, it's like there is no lockdown. Become more aware in the last week, there is more cars on the road, more people out on the street. Its as though everything is back to normal. More cars on the motorway going to and home from the office aswell.

A2B · Post by **A2B** » 27 Apr 2020, 18:37

Yeah same in my area, so frustrating to see.

TheStrangler · Post by **TheStrangler** » 27 Apr 2020, 18:38

What about all the other countries, particularly those in Europe that are gradually relaxing lockdown.
What are their methods for re-opening schools, shops etc.
I'm definitely not one of those calling for a quick end to lockdown, it just seems at times as if we are the only country going through this with no others experiences to draw on.
It was often said that worse case scenario would be to be as badly hit as Italy (with more elderly population) yet I think our deaths are only about 5,000 below them and they're gradually now coming out of lockdown.

A2B · Post by **A2B** » 27 Apr 2020, 19:24

Everyone refers to it as lockdown but it's neen nothing of the sort and the advice given is so vauge you can understand why people are gradually reverting back to their old ways.

Children in Spain were allowed out for the first time in 45 days yesterday here they are going on bike rides and walking around with their mates

sindba · Post by **sindba** » 27 Apr 2020, 19:34

TheStrangler wrote:What about all the other countries, particularly those in Europe that are gradually relaxing lockdown.
What are their methods for re-opening schools, shops etc.
I'm definitely not one of those calling for a quick end to lockdown, it just seems at times as if we are the only country going through this with no others experiences to draw on.
It was often said that worse case scenario would be to be as badly hit as Italy (with more elderly population) yet I think our deaths are only about 5,000 below them and they're gradually now coming out of lockdown.

We have the 5th highest death rate in the world (deaths per million population)

BUT unlike most countries we aren't even counting everyone. If you include deaths outside hospital (homes, care homes etc) we might even be THE worst hit by some estimates.

If anything our restrictions should be tightened.

paul1231 · Post by **paul1231** » 27 Apr 2020, 21:07

danny2006 wrote:Don't know about other areas, but where I work, it's like there is no lockdown. Become more aware in the last week, there is more cars on the road, more people out on the street. Its as though everything is back to normal. More cars on the motorway going to and home from the office aswell.

Same here theres cars every where and I'm seeing loads more of people walking round then i ever have. Its like first few weeks people were worried they'd be stopped and now its just like they noticed nothings happening so just visiting every one and going out for drives to see them

norris9 · Post by **norris9** » 28 Apr 2020, 08:37

paul1231 wrote:
danny2006 wrote:Don't know about other areas, but where I work, it's like there is no lockdown. Become more aware in the last week, there is more cars on the road, more people out on the street. Its as though everything is back to normal. More cars on the motorway going to and home from the office aswell.
Same here theres cars every where and I'm seeing loads more of people walking round then i ever have. Its like first few weeks people were worried they'd be stopped and now its just like they noticed nothings happening so just visiting every one and going out for drives to see them

The rains here now so people will be staying indoors.

norris9 · Post by **norris9** » 28 Apr 2020, 08:44

Who would bother going to a shop where you might have to queue and risk getting the virus when you can get anything you want online.

Anyhow many shops have remained open throughout the coronavirus so I don't see why there's a sudden problem with other shops opening as long as they keep to distancing rules. I just doubt the smaller shops will have many customers.

scarface · Post by **scarface** » 28 Apr 2020, 09:09

Either way you look at it, this crisis will generate a sh££ loads of money for Royal Mail. It already did. I bet some of these crooks at the top of the company are praying for the corona not to stop.... Sadly we won't see a penny from it extra, at least for a very long time.

Woody Guthrie · Post by **Woody Guthrie** » 28 Apr 2020, 09:22

I don't see why there's a sudden problem with other shops opening as long as they keep to distancing rules

It's not a sudden problem, it's a problem of mathematics.
2 shops open on a high street with 50 customers a day means 100 people on that high street per day and social distancing is easy.

20 shops open on a high street causes an exponential growth in numbers because there are now 20 different reasons to go to the high street. Social distancing becomes impossible even outside the shops.

Outside my bank yesterday there was a line of people halfway down the street, people had to step into the road to maintain social distancing, many couldn't be bothered. Replicate that across a street full of open shops, hairdressers, bookmakers and coffee shops.....

Post by **wallop** » 28 Apr 2020, 15:54

Woody Guthrie wrote:
I don't see why there's a sudden problem with other shops opening as long as they keep to distancing rules
It's not a sudden problem, it's a problem of mathematics.
2 shops open on a high street with 50 customers a day means 100 people on that high street per day and social distancing is easy.

20 shops open on a high street causes an exponential growth in numbers because there are now 20 different reasons to go to the high street. Social distancing becomes impossible even outside the shops.

Outside my bank yesterday there was a line of people halfway down the street, people had to step into the road to maintain social distancing, many couldn't be bothered. Replicate that across a street full of open shops, hairdressers, bookmakers and coffee shops.....

Round the corner from me is a row of shops no town centre jobby just a row of local shops at the moment they are all closed bar the post office and you have to cross the road to maintain social distancing from the queue for just that one shop.