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I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 19:22

I have chucked in my CWU membership because:

1. At times I feel the union is run by incompetent and self serving dinosaurs.
2. The uploaded footage during the recent ballot gave grounds and ammunition to RM to remove our democratic right to withhold our labour.
3. The union showed time and again that they are incapable in protecting and safeguarding the interests of their paying members without compromising our fight to preserve our jobs and work rights?
4. I have only needed their help once after years of paying my member's fees and the rep sided with the management. I had to involve a solicitor at my expense and the matter was then resolved instantly.
5. The union had no intention of calling their/our bluff of a pre Christmas strike. Although the appeal should already have gone in, citing "our strong" and "clear cut case", they have failed to do so to date. Not a chance in a million for a postal strike happening now this side of Christmas even if an appeal is eventually lodged and upheld in our favour. The CWU are not truthful with their members in this respect.
6. When asked, live on Sky News, Dave Ward refused to give any reassurances whatsoever that the union would not postpone the 'planned' strike if asked to do so by Jeremy Corbyn and he also failed to confirm that the CWU would disregard the instructions of the Labour party on that matter, thus focusing only on the interests of its members instead.
7. At the current rate for the sub fees, it costs £135.20 annually. Multiplying that by so many years, it becomes a serious amount of money down the drain.

I am not encouraging or discouraging anyone to cancel their membership. This is entirely their decision based on their needs. However, as the union have a habit of not showing much interest in its members and they did not ever bother to ask if there's anything they could do to help me change my mind, I'm putting my reasons here.
Last edited by clique on 17 Nov 2019, 22:34, edited 2 times in total.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 19:38

clique wrote:I have chucked in my CWU membership because:

5. ..... Although the appeal should already have gone in, citing "our strong" and "clear cut case", they have failed to do so to date. ...


The CWU have 14 days in which to appeal the decision. So imminently this will happen.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 19:44

I've tried to contact the CWU several times and no help, I am feed up, always the same, phoned my reps and they pass the buck, best to do it's just get on with it and forget about the Union. I am out guys.
Last edited by ruorbe on 17 Nov 2019, 22:06, edited 1 time in total.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 19:52

rogersh wrote:
clique wrote:I have chucked in my CWU membership because:

5. ..... Although the appeal should already have gone in, citing "our strong" and "clear cut case", they have failed to do so to date. ...


The CWU have 14 days in which to appeal the decision. So imminently this will happen.


True! Then we will have to wait for a hearing date. After that, the union is required to give 14 days notice ahead of any planned strikes. Clearly if they really had the intention to take this unique opportunity to make our voices heard, they should have announced the date/s of the strike straight after the ballot results. That would have put us in a much stronger position and would have enabled us to carry out our threat. They were never really going to call for a December 2019 strike, were they?

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 20:05

Stick with the union, don't be a one man clique and together we will beat the employer. Stand strong man :thumbup

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 20:31

The weekly pay rise the union has got me significantly dwarfs several pound a week subs so those “incompetent and self serving dinosaurs” are doing ok with me.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 21:20

Good idea. We would all be so much better off with no union. RM are well known for their generosity.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 21:29

Actually I know where Clique is coming from. I'm only in the Union for the fact that a Unionised workplace is better than of one without.

The CWU might blow their own trumpets telling us how good their social media campaign was in getting a 97 percent YES vote but it wasn't it also the social media campaign that means we can't strike?

So how does the Union respond? By appealing the decision??? We need to re-ballot the members and get things done in the right way and ASAP before Xmas. I don't believe in the conspiracy theories that the CWU leaders didn't really want us to strike because if that were the case then why spend precious time and money building up the campaign to strike in the 1st place?? They were caught out by Royal Mail in court before and they have been caught out again. Whoever runs the legal side of things in the CWU really needs to up their game.

Also, I once needed Union help years ago and I also felt that the Union rep (who was a senior rep at the time) sided with the managers. Ironically, he also became a manager himself a few years later! It has led to a massive mistrust of Union reps on my part particularly as I now see the current Unit rep agree-ing and signing all sorts of stuff with the current DOM, but I'm sure they have a purpose and a role to fill in their office.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 21:33

Dont give up on the Union. Its all you have. The Union is not separate from its members, it is its members and that is what gives us out negotiating power. Without the Union are you going to stand alone against your bullying managers?
Personally I do not agree with almost all of the recent agreements that the Union get, I want them to be far more militant and they should have stopped the company changing many things that have led to this point. However I recognise the Union has to take the membership with them. In an ideal world we would be prepared to go on strike indefinitely until we got what we wanted. Unfortunately nobody has had the bottle or are prepared to make the sacrifices necessary ever since Thatcher destroyed the Miners. Without that 100% commitment the Union will always have to fight with one arm tied behind its back. What has happened here is the Courts and the Government has now tied its other arm behind its back. So do not blame the Union, as its the members collective will that determines what they can do. Its your support that gives the Union power so please think carefully before cancelling memberships.
I think the Union should now announce a strike for a date that would be immediately after the appeal has been heard(and won I hope) whatever date that is. It should also be a week long strike. In the meantime they should and if the judgement again goes against us the Union should urge all members to use Christmas to Earn as much money as they can, and save up a war chest of cash to fight a long hard strike campaign. We need to show them that by removing our right to take strike action they will only make it more likely that they will have longer strikes later on.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 21:41

Cutting your nose off to spite your face. Yes, the union are amateurish at times. The reaction to this judgement has been embarrassing; instead of admitting and apologising for the balls up they accuse the courts of having some kind of agenda. The same type of crap the daily fail trots out about remainer judges when they rule against certain politicians. All being said though, we earn 12 quid an hour as oppose to eight because we have a union; we need to support it. Of course it's fair to criticize it from time to time.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 21:46

Flashman_ wrote:Dont give up on the Union. Its all you have. The Union is not separate from its members, it is its members and that is what gives us out negotiating power. Without the Union are you going to stand alone against your bullying managers?
Personally I do not agree with almost all of the recent agreements that the Union get, I want them to be far more militant and they should have stopped the company changing many things that have led to this point. However I recognise the Union has to take the membership with them. In an ideal world we would be prepared to go on strike indefinitely until we got what we wanted. Unfortunately nobody has had the bottle or are prepared to make the sacrifices necessary ever since Thatcher destroyed the Miners. Without that 100% commitment the Union will always have to fight with one arm tied behind its back. What has happened here is the Courts and the Government has now tied its other arm behind its back. So do not blame the Union, as its the members collective will that determines what they can do. Its your support that gives the Union power so please think carefully before cancelling memberships.
I think the Union should now announce a strike for a date that would be immediately after the appeal has been heard(and won I hope) whatever date that is. It should also be a week long strike. In the meantime they should and if the judgement again goes against us the Union should urge all members to use Christmas to Earn as much money as they can, and save up a war chest of cash to fight a long hard strike campaign. We need to show them that by removing our right to take strike action they will only make it more likely that they will have longer strikes later on.


The courts uphold the law; they're independent from the government as Johnson found out when he was found to have unlawfully prorogued parliament. Yes the Trade Union act restricts the union and by all means lobby against it, but it is the law as things stand.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 22:00

GOODBYE THEN,GOOD LUCK. :wave

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 22:01

Seymour Buts wrote:
Flashman_ wrote:Dont give up on the Union. Its all you have. The Union is not separate from its members, it is its members and that is what gives us out negotiating power. Without the Union are you going to stand alone against your bullying managers?
Personally I do not agree with almost all of the recent agreements that the Union get, I want them to be far more militant and they should have stopped the company changing many things that have led to this point. However I recognise the Union has to take the membership with them. In an ideal world we would be prepared to go on strike indefinitely until we got what we wanted. Unfortunately nobody has had the bottle or are prepared to make the sacrifices necessary ever since Thatcher destroyed the Miners. Without that 100% commitment the Union will always have to fight with one arm tied behind its back. What has happened here is the Courts and the Government has now tied its other arm behind its back. So do not blame the Union, as its the members collective will that determines what they can do. Its your support that gives the Union power so please think carefully before cancelling memberships.
I think the Union should now announce a strike for a date that would be immediately after the appeal has been heard(and won I hope) whatever date that is. It should also be a week long strike. In the meantime they should and if the judgement again goes against us the Union should urge all members to use Christmas to Earn as much money as they can, and save up a war chest of cash to fight a long hard strike campaign. We need to show them that by removing our right to take strike action they will only make it more likely that they will have longer strikes later on.


The courts uphold the law; they're independent from the government as Johnson found out when he was found to have unlawfully prorogued parliament. Yes the Trade Union act restricts the union and by all means lobby against it, but it is the law as things stand.


I mentioned the government because the Judge cited the General election as what Tipped the balance of his decision to grant the injunction, Legally he had no jurisdiction to rule on that as it is not illegal or otherwise to have a strike during a GE. IMO this would indicate Government involvement. "The court upholding the law" will be determined in an appeal! So the law is not yet set in the case!

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 22:24

Flashman_ wrote:... I think the Union should now announce a strike for a date that would be immediately after the appeal has been heard(and won I hope) whatever date that is. It should also be a week long strike...


I totally agree. One day strikes here and there will not achieve much. There will be some disruption but RM will see it through. If only people here could take a leaf out of how effective the French are at striking. Good luck convincing a large number of our colleagues to do the same.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 22:30

30+YEARMAN wrote:GOODBYE THEN,GOOD LUCK. :wave

Yes, thank you! I can manage DOM and line manager pressure and bullying attempts just fine. Although I'm no longer in the union, I will be out on the picket line in support if/when a strike is called.

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 22:52

postslippete wrote:So how does the Union respond? By appealing the decision??? We need to re-ballot the members and get things done in the right way and ASAP before Xmas. I don't believe in the conspiracy theories that the CWU leaders didn't really want us to strike because if that were the case then why spend precious time and money building up the campaign to strike in the 1st place?? They were caught out by Royal Mail in court before and they have been caught out again. Whoever runs the legal side of things in the CWU really needs to up their game.


There was a mention of 6 weeks in another thread that the ballot process takes so unless the appeal is won any strike will be after xmas

Flashman_ wrote:I think the Union should now announce a strike for a date that would be immediately after the appeal has been heard(and won I hope) whatever date that is.


That would be risky, my gut feeling is that if that were to happen, RM would challenge it in the courts

I cancelled my union subscription

17 Nov 2019, 22:56

clique wrote:
rogersh wrote:
clique wrote:I have chucked in my CWU membership because:

5. ..... Although the appeal should already have gone in, citing "our strong" and "clear cut case", they have failed to do so to date. ...


The CWU have 14 days in which to appeal the decision. So imminently this will happen.


True! Then we will have to wait for a hearing date. After that, the union is required to give 14 days notice ahead of any planned strikes. Clearly if they really had the intention to take this unique opportunity to make our voices heard, they should have announced the date/s of the strike straight after the ballot results. That would have put us in a much stronger position and would have enabled us to carry out our threat. They were never really going to call for a December 2019 strike, were they?


The ballot results were announced in the final week of the mediation talks which ended on the 18th October. The following week was for consideration of the report & two further weeks as a final opportunity to reach agreement. As part of a 3 week protection period.

The mediators report stated;
(5) As regards the length of the period during which strike notice would not be given, it should be not less than that already offered in mediation (until 13th November) and ideally should be longer.

You will know the union had arranged to meet senior reps & the executive on 13th November. The high court injunction was announced subsequently to be heard on the 12th.

I cancelled my union subscription

18 Nov 2019, 06:01

I've got to admit I do struggle to fully back the unions stance in this dispute... it does sound a bit ridiculous for them to be going on about ''protecting the public service''... What ''public service'' is that? Delivering junk mail and ebay tat mostly.

Also their refusal to accept any changes that would lead to job losses, mainly through a reduction in the USO... I can't help thinking this is more about the union wanting to keep it's membership numbers (and income from subs) as high as possible rather than acting solely in the best interests of it's members.

I'm almost certain there are many thousands of posties that would jump at the chance of VR and many more who would like to reduce their hours... the union should be accepting that there is scope to ''streamline'' the business and should instead be fighting for the best possible deals for those who do want to leave, whilst also fighting to protect the pay and T&C's for those who wish to stay.

I cancelled my union subscription

18 Nov 2019, 07:58

It's like being at a football match.

In front of me are a group of supporters singing in full voice. They have been here before, this is their team and they will always be there.

To my right there are more supporters ready to recognise the flaws in their team and recognise a mistake or an own goal when it happens. These supporters know the team has given them many good times, this is not the time to be giving up, and the whole team is worth supporting.

To my left there are others some new, some have been unfortunate and been to a few bad games and then there are few looking for an excuse to save themselves a few bob and get the early train home.

One of these guys is leaving,I look up at the clock, ten minutes has gone. I'm thinking, we will probably score by the time he gets out of the stadium, never mind by the time he gets home. I'm also thinking my team may lose but somebody has definitely lost already.

I cancelled my union subscription

18 Nov 2019, 09:16

wacko74 wrote:
Also their refusal to accept any changes that would lead to job losses, mainly through a reduction in the USO... I


https://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communi ... 47#p858147

The following is an excerpt from the above link by Martin Walsh.

The last part of their strategy is they want to increase productivity to around 5% per year over the next 5 years which is hours will mean the equivalent of 20 thousand full time jobs.

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