not on facebook
ANNOUNCEMENT : ALL OF ROYAL MAIL'S EMPLOYMENT POLICIES (AGREEMENTS) AT A GLANCE (UPDATED APR 2019)... HERE

ANNOUNCEMENT : NEW CORONAVIRUS FORUM... HERE



Outrageous sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 13:45

https://www.cwu.org/news/outrageous?fbc ... IMzW7eWJs0

“This is probably one of the most outrageous dismissals by Royal Mail and Tribunal verdict I’ve ever heard about,” says CWU outdoor secretary Mark Baulch, in reaction to the upholding of a postman’s dismissal for allegedly being one minute late with a special delivery item.

“Make no mistake, this union is appealing this decision legally and, in the meantime, we’ll also be taking up this case with the company at the highest possible level,” he continues, adding his “anger and sheer disbelief” at both the outcome of the Tribunal and the original sacking by the company.

“If it was solely that he was just one minute late, then this would be a strong mitigation on its own,” Mark explains, “but in this case, the postman actually arrived inside the premises – a high street bank – four minutes before the 1pm special delivery time.

“And the only reason that he was unable to obtain the signature of receipt that he needed was because he was told he had to wait in the queue along with the other bank customers.”

Robert Lockyer, who has worked for the business for 29 years, was fired from his job at Ashford Delivery Office in October of 2018, after management accused him of “gross misconduct” for the alleged one-minute delay, citing PDA (postal digital assistant) data as evidence.

“But what’s impossible to understand – and what’s truly infuriating here – is that the management were not prepared to accept data from the same PDA clearly proving that he actually arrived inside this delivery customer’s premises a full four minutes before the deadline,” Mark points out.

Mr Lockyer’s case was appealed by the union through the appropriate internal Royal Mail procedures and, after this failed to win justice, the issue was submitted to the Employment Tribunal, which heard the case in July and delivered its verdict – upholding the dismissal – last month.

Mark Baulch says that the details of this case “almost make it impossible to even do the job – and it also demonstrates why our members should back the union in this current ballot.

“If someone actually arrives inside a commercial premises, with the delivery item within the deadline specified, then there is clearly no delay on the part of the delivery worker – in this instance, the delay is obviously due to the unusual procedure of the bank itself in telling our member to queue alongside the other bank customers.

“How on earth our member could be considered to be at fault here is completely beyond m – this is why the culture within the workplace must change, once and for all.

“We’ve got to achieve justice for Rob Lockyer – we cannot allow such unfairness to go unchallenged,” Mark insists.

Mr Lockyer says that he is “bitterly upset” at the “harsh” treatment of him by the company.

“I can’t believe what has happened to me – all I wanted to do was to do my job.

“I really hope the union can make this right. I just want to get back to work.”

POSTMAN EDIT: Judgement added
Mr_R_Lockyer_v_Royal_Mail_Group_Ltd_2304480-2018_Full.pdf
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by POSTMAN on 23 Sep 2019, 09:33, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Added judgement

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 14:21

Sounds like the managers got it in for him, being late with a special not even a sackable offence.

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 15:00

Not much help for the guy now but I would advise anyone who thinks they may be cutting it fine with a special to raise it with management before they leave the office, if it means moving your delivery around and costing the business overtime tough.

Don't cut it fine, get them to manage it.

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 17:20

I know Mark Baulch has given the details of this case, but there's GOT to be more than meets the eye here. not even a warning? and only a MINUTE late. AND they are not accepting he was at the delivery point BEFORE the deadline.? we,ve been late a couple of times with specials, and absolutely NOTHING was even said. a guy last week was 2 HOURS over, but it was put down to an oversight and NOTHING was said. how can it even be classed as gross misconduct? how could an employment tribunal even consider agreeing with RM?. if it is indeed as Mark Baulch has said, and ONLY that, then I have no doubt the guy will be re-instated. they can't be allowed to get away with crap like this. if that had been our office, I can guarantee we ALL would've walked out for that. and we would've stayed out. why hasn't his office done so?? he needs the backing of us ALL nationwide if this is indeed the ONLY thing this lad has done wrong!!

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 17:31

Seems outrageous if this is accurate and surely ammunition for the cwu in getting a big yes vote. Mistakes happen in our office like this and usually are brought in with work place coach and coached. Is this just a ploy by royal mail to get rid of long serving staff or more to this story than meets the eye ?

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 18:55

Well this is a great advert for the union. If this couldn’t be stopped with the current legally binding agreement in place then how is a resounding yes vote to save said agreement not change it going to stop this from happening in the future. More union “half the story” bullshit.

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 19:24

Anyone in a similar situation - ' Not Delivered ' & ' Refused ' would be my options

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 19:39

Asked to join the queue of customers, that would have been a 739 if it was me.

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 20:13

Not getting the full story here.

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 21:26

There has to be more to the case than what is being reported here. In my office in the last few months there has been a couple of late specials. All that happened to those responsible, they got some coaching and told to be more careful in future

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 22:07

SSkUNkY wrote:Not getting the full story here.

Totally agree

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

20 Sep 2019, 22:11

NWpostie wrote:Sounds like the managers got it in for him, being late with a special not even a sackable offence.

Should'nt matter wether manager has it in for him are not if even a an employment tribunal agree he should be sacked.. surely more to be told to this case.

Outrageous sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic workplace culture

21 Sep 2019, 03:25

No wonder we are balloting for action big YES and let's put this MAN's plight first and foremost if they treat him like this how long before us all.

‘Outrageous’ sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic’ workplace culture

21 Sep 2019, 09:14

aiden01 wrote:
NWpostie wrote:Sounds like the managers got it in for him, being late with a special not even a sackable offence.

Should'nt matter wether manager has it in for him are not if even a an employment tribunal agree he should be sacked.. surely more to be told to this case.


Indeed, there is a possibility of history of poor performace for all we know or an extremely unpopular member of staff that would drop you in the poo for personal gain.

I'm sure we've all come across such types in our workplace, the fact the office didn't do a walk out is interesting as I've looked on the internet and there is no mention of a walkout..

Outrageous sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic workplace culture

21 Sep 2019, 10:06

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... 8_Full.pdf

Outrageous sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic workplace culture

21 Sep 2019, 11:51

I don't agree with the tribunal, it clearly wasn't intentional delay of the mail the guy may have just misplaced or overlooked the special, the fact he was at the delivery point should meet the criteria of a successful delivery anyway, if he'd entered into the pda he couldn't deliver it at 12.59pm which is entirely true as nobody was to hand to sign for it, and then proceeded to get a signature at 1.01pm there'd be no case to answer anyway as it wouldn't even flag up on the system.

Shocking that somebody has 29 years service and no loyalty or discretion is shown.

Outrageous sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic workplace culture

21 Sep 2019, 15:43

so it is fair to say that this ''manager'' did indeed have it in for him. he could've simply disregarded the bank ''reggie'' as most decent managers or even crap managers would've done. but because he's got previous, he made himself a target. I agree it was not wilful delay but they've took a chance to get rid of him by looking for any excuse, and they found it. being late with his tribunal forms didn't help him neither. sad SAD state of affairs. he'll lose his pension as well. (unless he's already in receipt of it). 29 yrs down the swanney.

Outrageous sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic workplace culture

22 Sep 2019, 08:14

I have absolutely no sympathy for the postie. If you read the full story, not the cwu version, you'd see why. The guy had been put on probation for leaving a van unsecured and while on probation had another sign for incident and was told one more and you're out......then the daft bugger waits in a queue until it's too late....really how stupid is that? You'd make sure you do everything right with your job on the line surely. You'd have just said someone has to sign for this now or it goes back. Simple. This 'story' is just the Union trying to spread propaganda at this time of ballot. It's shocking. Cwu should actually be fighting for people that do the job right.

Outrageous sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic workplace culture

22 Sep 2019, 08:18

norm wrote:I don't agree with the tribunal, it clearly wasn't intentional delay of the mail the guy may have just misplaced or overlooked the special, the fact he was at the delivery point should meet the criteria of a successful delivery anyway, if he'd entered into the pda he couldn't deliver it at 12.59pm which is entirely true as nobody was to hand to sign for it, and then proceeded to get a signature at 1.01pm there'd be no case to answer anyway as it wouldn't even flag up on the system.

Shocking that somebody has 29 years service and no loyalty or discretion is shown.

Actually we've been told last week that this is no longer the case. If you scan again after one, then it's goes as a failure. Of cours, nobody told us that though.

Outrageous sacking of postman demonstrates 'toxic workplace culture

22 Sep 2019, 08:34

The Mirror has both sides of the story here, if you don't fancy wading through the tribunal judgement. https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/r ... 140652.amp

Previous page Next page


Page 1 of 3   1, 2, 3