BBC PANORAMA DISCUSSION THREAD

[pony]

The marine did the walk like RM think we should do it but even then he struggled.
I know he went to slightly more drops but i must go to 90% and with time added on for knocking on doors,739's,messing around in box for next bundles, it can easily go over 4 hours.
Not forgetting the 15 mins of another walk we get made to take out.
Anything over 3.45 hours and i really feel it.If its my saturday off and i have to do 4 hours for 5 days i am ready to drop.
Its ok running round once but its not like excercise,it isn't doing our bodies any good.
I just hope we have a case to claim some compo when we're old and knackered like miners and machine operators have done.
If jobs have to be lost then so be it but there is only so much a human can take.
And what did that clown say.." they might have 4 extra packets but 50 less letters".
I know packets are up but even with no packets i still have twice the mail in my bag than i did 15 years ago.Thats a fact,not in my head or on some dodgy mail counting machine.

[mmax]

Hi all, as some of you know that I am a DOM before you shoot me down please read my posts and you will see what stance I take.

Well said mmax , what a refreshing change to hear a DOM with an opinion that isn't just repeated parrot fashion from the latest RM brief. But i feel that the majority of the DOM's are too scared to rock the boat or just like lemmings run towards their own destruction dragging the postal grades along with them. I was surprised to hear in the program that even at area level the management were querying the quantity of mail figures

certainly and issue regarding the "Figures" RM are portraying....

I carried out a year on year analysis in our office based on last years actual traffic versus this year actual and it came out the traffic calculated divided between the amount of walks in the office worked out at....remember this is based on the traffic that RM are feeding us with.....EACH POSTIE HAD 50 LETTERS LESS EACH!!....than last year........there's some food for thought.........

Yep and NAZI Germany was attacked by Poland on 31/8/1939 beginning the second world war but why should they treat you with anymore respect than us after all we all don't earn mega bucks!. :cfo :mfo

me personally...I don't get treated any different....or put this way I don't treat or ask any postie to do what I have not done, and I always treat my staff with respect, I talk to them like they talk to me.....I'm not on mega bucks...I can assure you!

[BELIAL]

"Look the issue of spans are not going to be determind by a national agreement, that wll be down to local negotations as of course offices will want to determind the levels of full time jobs and earnings and work methods."


I don't know what to say to that dingo,I really don't.
This was the one thing the members needed protection from at NATIONAL LEVEL.
It is not just the delivery speed that is the issue it is the length of deliveries.
I'm delighted your health and safety enigneers have analyised and concluded that it is safer to walk 4 hours on a walk without a bag on the shoulder.
How many pens and pieces of paper did they wear out doing that.

Agreed.
What can you say? Totally jawdroppingly gobsmacked.
I think we may need to form a union to protect us from the CWU's modernisation plan. This is almost turning into a theatrical farce along the lines of spot the difference -Tory/labour ; management /union officers
The mind boggles ,we've got PT staff working 2hrs unpaid daily , FT staff who work every day off and our union is considering the best way to cut more hours

[k979aaa]

I'm running the risk of upsetting you POSTMAN but i can't see how the CWU can ask the rest of the membership to increase their delivery span to 4hrs to protect fulltime jobs and allow you to keep yours with the use of P/T staff.
I may be missing the point and feel free to correct me if i am.

Are london not on a four day week though!.

[Exrep]

If like many of you on here have said longer delivery spans will be negotiated locally.

Well let me tell you boys somethink, this wont be discussed in our office they can offer F/T posts in return WE will not be black mailed.

In my eyes the way to protect F/T jobs is by putting us back on two deliveries and im sick and tired of hearing the B*LLSH*T about later deivery times of mail ,speed restricitons to vans etc etc its crap and some have accepted this and have been brainwashed into believeing this clap trap ffs wake up smell the coffee. This may work on the DOMS in R/M but not on the blue shirts well on some it wont.

Feck 4.5-5.0 delivery spans its not realistic regardless of whether your carrying a bag on our back or not.

Tell you what those that think its the way forward at the weekend or on your day off walk for 5 hrs solid ,come back on here and let us know how you felt,dont take a drink,dont have a p*ss break .After 3.5 delivery my knees feel ripped to pieces and im hobbling back to my D/O i dread to think of a longer delivery span.

[DirtyHarry]

I'd like to know how many hours a week that fat bastard puts in.

However many hours a plank like Tolhurst spends a week doing, errr, well, not an awful lot, it would take him at least 10 years to expend the energy that a postie does in a week.
Also, Tolhurst is management, "modernisation" doesn't apply to him and the rest of Royal Mail's incompetent management "team."

[DirtyHarry]

IMHO. The only thing that needed to be highlighted a bit more was the fact that your expected to keep up this very physical workrate until your 65. How many 60 year olds can move at 4mph with 16KG for 3.5 hours every working day?

Good point, Fluke. I wonder what Tolhurst's thoughts are on that one.

[fishtank]

I'm running the risk of upsetting you POSTMAN but i can't see how the CWU can ask the rest of the membership to increase their delivery span to 4hrs to protect fulltime jobs and allow you to keep yours with the use of P/T staff.
I may be missing the point and feel free to correct me if i am.

Are london not on a four day week though!.

They are on a four day week but this means they have a 10 hr day.
with 4hr on delivery,even with 30mins travelling and 50 mins break they have 4hrs 40mins indoor work.
If what dingo says is true it will be very difficult to justify this indoor workload.
Therefore it is pretty obvious their delivery span must increase also.
Unless they are allowed to use P/T staff to justify this which goes completely against what the CWU want.

[k979aaa]

If like many of you on here have said longer delivery spans will be negotiated locally.

Well let me tell you boys somethink, this wont be discussed in our office they can offer F/T posts in return WE will not be black mailed.

In my eyes the way to protect F/T jobs is by putting us back on two deliveries and im sick and tired of hearing the B*LLSH*T about later deivery times of mail ,speed restricitons to vans etc etc its crap and some have accepted this and have been brainwashed into believeing this clap trap ffs wake up smell the coffee. This may work on the DOMS in R/M but not on the blue shirts well on some it wont.

Feck 4.5-5.0 delivery spans its not realistic regardless of whether your carrying a bag on our back or not.

Tell you what those that think its the way forward at the weekend or on your day off walk for 5 hrs solid ,come back on here and let us know how you felt,dont take a drink,dont have a p*ss break .After 3.5 delivery my knees feel ripped to pieces and im hobbling back to my D/O i dread to think of a longer delivery span.

The only way too end all this s**t is to start on time use no cars take a bag out or two return to the office take another bag or two and Finnish on your time and end the rush for the boss culture for they gain all the bonuses and we do all the work!.

[k979aaa]

I'm running the risk of upsetting you POSTMAN but i can't see how the CWU can ask the rest of the membership to increase their delivery span to 4hrs to protect fulltime jobs and allow you to keep yours with the use of P/T staff.
I may be missing the point and feel free to correct me if i am.

Are london not on a four day week though!.

They are on a four day week but this means they have a 10 hr day.
with 4hr on delivery,even with 30mins travelling and 50 mins break they have 4hrs 40mins indoor work.
If what dingo says is true it will be very difficult to justify this indoor workload.
Therefore it is pretty obvious their delivery span must increase also.
Unless they are allowed to use P/T staff to justify this which goes completely against what the CWU want.

Our office is somewhat more down the road than you then as we have on our section 20 odd walks with 5 or 6 part time as such we may lose some more with the introduction of CDV's deliveries as we have walk sequencing!.

[pony]

There's got to be a limit to the amount of outside hours.
If there was no sorting at all and you left the office with 6 hours of working time left,could you actually deliver mail for 6 hours?
I don't think anybody could for more than a few weeks or months maybe.
I'd probably last about 3 days :)
Don't forget that RM 3.5 hours actually means over 4.So i don't think i'd be capable of delivering a "5" hour delivery.
Safeguarding jobs? Most would have to pack theirs in anyway.

[axeman]

It's not about missing the boat 'dingo' but openining the floodgates..................

[Exrep]

Pony thats what R/M hope that Full timers end up packing it all in as we are seen in there eyes as the dinosaurs of the business and its one way of getting us out.

[k979aaa]

There's got to be a limit to the amount of outside hours.
If there was no sorting at all and you left the office with 6 hours of working time left,could you actually deliver mail for 6 hours?
I don't think anybody could for more than a few weeks or months maybe.
I'd probably last about 3 days :)
Don't forget that RM 3.5 hours actually means over 4.So i don't think i'd be capable of delivering a "5" hour delivery.
Safeguarding jobs? Most would have to pack theirs in anyway.

For that is what they want rid of fultime staff and in with partime staff on less hours + more wonga for the few :cfo and less service for all!.

[DirtyHarry]

"we like to call it co-opetition"

Businessmen, and I use that term lightly with regard to crooks like Tolhurst and his oppo at TNT, are masters of the art of talking cobblers. It's a Private Public Partnership, nothing more. Crozier agreed to the terms of this partnership because he possesses about as much business acumen, as does a slug.