Hellmail article by Mark White

Night Tonic · Post by **Night Tonic** » 13 Apr 2008, 11:04

No other toys to play with I suppose and not the first time Nazgul has come up with this one either. For the record, my early years in the armed forces are the reason I have an interest in planes but I'm saying no more than that as I, like everyone else on here is entitled to anonymity otherwise once we've sunk to becoming a witch hunt, the entire forum is stuffed.

There was a piece on HM ony a few months back that went on about in-fighting and witch hunts on here and if new joiners are to expect the spanish inquisiton too, then they're not going to stay are they. This is why you can have 5000 members but only 200-300 ever coming back, and out of those, only around 20 that post regularly. In the same way that mail volume does not sit on the same graph as profit, member numbers do not equal 5000 that all think the same way. Speculate all you like Nazgul, but two others from my office ALSO use this site too and as has been stated on here many times, its important that everyone is able to use it without putting their jobs on the line - or making the site look anal.

Sometimes Belial and Nobert don't agree with me but I don't take it personally. There are lots of things we DO agree on. If you think I'm some plant, thats fine, but these silly, speculative guessing games don't help anyone Nazgul. Don't make yourself look idotic by assuming that because I can string more than three lines together, that I must be a DOM, management, or some spy from Hellmail - it makes us all sound like we're illiterate morons. Just take your finger out your bum for five minutes and maybe, just maybe we can have something WORTH talking about.

Post by **rhino49** » 13 Apr 2008, 11:38

Night Tonic wrote:No other toys to play with I suppose and not the first time Nazgul has come up with this one either. For the record, my early years in the armed forces are the reason I have an interest in planes but I'm saying no more than that as I, like everyone else on here is entitled to anonymity otherwise once we've sunk to becoming a witch hunt, the entire forum is stuffed.

There was a piece on HM ony a few months back that went on about in-fighting and witch hunts on here and if new joiners are to expect the spanish inquisiton too, then they're not going to stay are they. This is why you can have 5000 members but only 200-300 ever coming back, and out of those, only around 20 that post regularly. In the same way that mail volume does not sit on the same graph as profit, member numbers do not equal 5000 that all think the same way. Speculate all you like Nazgul, but two others from my office ALSO use this site too and as has been stated on here many times, its important that everyone is able to use it without putting their jobs on the line - or making the site look anal.

Sometimes Belial and Nobert don't agree with me but I don't take it personally. There are lots of things we DO agree on. If you think I'm some plant, thats fine, but these silly, speculative guessing games don't help anyone Nazgul. Don't make yourself look idotic by assuming that because I can string more than three lines together, that I must be a DOM, management, or some spy from Hellmail - it makes us all sound like we're illiterate morons. Just take your finger out your bum for five minutes and maybe, just maybe we can have something WORTH talking about.

Good comment Night Tonic - and for the record Nazgul - I am also fond of the dash, and like to check and prepare my posts to make them as readable as possible instead of firing off missiles that need an interpreter to make sense of. Peoples presentation styles do NOT define their origin or political or social leanings - only their respect for the reader.

DGP1 · Post by **DGP1** » 13 Apr 2008, 12:02

because I can string more than three lines together, that I must be a DOM, management

Surely that would exclude you from management

Night Tonic · Post by **Night Tonic** » 13 Apr 2008, 12:04

lol - rather good disgruntled.

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 13 Apr 2008, 13:16

Can I just say as MOD that if anyone does find out the identity of another poster then they had better keep it secret or as Night Tonic says it destroys the whole point of being able to be anonymous on here.

I would hope and believe that anyone who does "out" another member is immediately banned/expelled by POSTMAN.

If you do, from information you read in someone's post, identify them, then do the decent thing and warn them by PM so that the offending post/s can be amended or deleted. After all we can't agree all the time but I hope we all treat people the way we would expect to be treated ourselves.

pinstripe · Post by **pinstripe** » 13 Apr 2008, 14:14

Well said TBT.

If we all agreed all the time, then what would be the point of discussing anything, or even RMC. Different point of views, opinions and attitudes are to be expected and encouraged. Not agreeing with another poster shows that your own opinion is not the only one. If you disagree debate the issue.

norbert · Post by **norbert** » 13 Apr 2008, 16:33

Nazgul wrote:
k66yla wrote:
Nazgul wrote: Oh boy you've really cracked me up with that one!
Pity the rest of the forum doesn't know who you are - then they could all have a laugh at that one.
I could do with a laugh the week I've had so why don't you tell us who he is then
Anybody who had the misfortune to be a member of the Postman crap forum will remember the poster known as 'Hellmail', and there was no big secret as to who he was. Well Night Tonic uses exactly the same prose and text as 'Hellmail' did, especially when summarising a paragraph.

Night Tonic has also stated on here that he runs his own site, which he has subtly described as being 'A Firey Plane'. Hell i can't think where that could possibly be!!

Also anybody who checks through Night Tonic's posts will notice how fond he is of using the dash - which is probably pure coincidence but if you read Steve Lawson's article on Hellmail you will notice he is also very fond of using the dash - particularly when summarising.

However i suppose i had better say that it is all pure speculation!

there is a famous plane called a spitfire

Post by **rockytony67** » 13 Apr 2008, 18:31

pinstripe wrote:Well said TBT.

If we all agreed all the time, then what would be the point of discussing anything, or even RMC. Different point of views, opinions and attitudes are to be expected and encouraged. Not agreeing with another poster shows that your own opinion is not the only one. If you disagree debate the issue.

You are quite right Pinstripe, debate is what it's all about, but debate is all about people being truthful about who they are and what they stand for, if I'm debating with someone who claims to be a postman but in reality is the owner of a website that in my view is anti trade unions then I have the right to question that person. As regards Night Tonic I enjoy his post's(although I don't agree with them) but I accept what he Say's that he is not who I thought he was and as such I apologize to him.

norbert · Post by **norbert** » 13 Apr 2008, 18:45

rockytony67 wrote:
pinstripe wrote:Well said TBT.

If we all agreed all the time, then what would be the point of discussing anything, or even RMC. Different point of views, opinions and attitudes are to be expected and encouraged. Not agreeing with another poster shows that your own opinion is not the only one. If you disagree debate the issue.
You are quite right Pinstripe, debate is what it's all about, but debate is all about people being truthful about who they are and what they stand for, if I'm debating with someone who claims to be a postman but in reality is the owner of a website that in my view is anti trade unions then I have the right to question that person. As regards Night Tonic I enjoy his post's(although I don't agree with them) but I accept what he Say's that he is not who I thought he was and as such I apologize to him.

Union Officals have alleged that Business Post Managers have threatened staff that join the CWU with the sack which is illegal under Employment Law -it also made the union all the more determined to recruit , some staff are on NMW , they have to work in a world beyond BT , RM , Quadrant and Parcelfarce .

White does make a good point about RM typically having one idea and lacking vision and imagination in products and marketing but it's been that way for a while . Some of it's "better" managers have jumped ship to the couriers.

Business Post are one of Hellmail's advertisers , the other thing is half these Parcel Firms wouldn't dare try this on their own countries , but that's the good Old Uncle Sam Influence .

Night Tonic · Post by **Night Tonic** » 13 Apr 2008, 19:18

No offence taken Rocky and yes I agree, we can all disagree on some matters (and me more than most admittedly) but if we didn't it'd be dull as hell (excuse the pun).

In terms of sites on the whole, I read quite a few and I wouldn't say that Hellmail was anti-union. Some writers may be, but thats the same everywhere - even in the press. Quite often they sit in our corner on many things and their Euro-stuff is usually days, sometimes weeks ahead of everone else. Personally I think its great that they've managed to cover as much as they do and lift the lid off many things that others just gloss over. Sure, if you were looking for a clone of RMC then you won't find it, but they were the first to even have a forum and seem to be making a real go of what they're doing. Some good stuff on there by posties too:

http://www.hellmail.co.uk/postalnews/te ... 5&zoneid=5

http://www.hellmail.co.uk/postalnews/te ... 5&zoneid=5

http://www.hellmail.co.uk/postalnews/te ... 7&zoneid=5

There was also a massive article written by a postwoman weeks ago that was brilliant and refreshingly honest about what the job is like now.

RMC does have news but its from the papers or work related and some things get missed altogether I've found, which is why i read everywhere. One daft decision in the EU can have massive consequences - look at where we are now. The world doesn't end at Leighton, even if we'd like to push him off it. RMC does what it does great, but its only one source in dozens out there and on vote predictions it was way off last year. For that reason alone I prefer to make my own mind up based on a cross-section of viewpoints. Even Norbert reads a lot which is why he can make some good posts based on accrued knowledge.