stage warnings

[peterthetree]

please can you tell me if RM can put members straight onto a stage 2 or stage 3 without issuing a stage 1 or 2 and not having any back to work interviews ?
Do RM have to follow their own procedures befor they can do this.Or can they just say they forgot to issue other stages and lump them all together.

[whisperstar24]

the business have to do the stages in the correct order and no they cannot put you onto a stage 2 without putting you on a stage 1.
They must give you an RTW within 3 hours of a return to work on the first day back from an absence. You could argue that they did not follow the procedure on the RTW as well.
If they miss a trigger for a stage 1 interview that is their problem as a stage 1 prompt should be done in a reasonable time scale. Waiting for 3 months to do a previous stage warning should be thrown out. Use your rep to deal with any situation and if things have not been done right so far, put in a grievance with your reps support on the basis of correct procedures not being followed.

[Mortdike123]

My manager tried to "fire me" but he couldn't due to the fact I was permanent staff. He didn't care about rules and regulations which he was in total breach of.
It is entirely possible that a manager would be THAT stupid!
It happened to me

[b&wcat]

If I was issued a stage one but haven't received any paperwork stating this or any paper work on a return to work does the stage one count? I've been back months now but haven't received anything other than a verbal!

[UnhappyGremlin]

If I was issued a stage one but haven't received any paperwork stating this or any paper work on a return to work does the stage one count? I've been back months now but haven't received anything other than a verbal!

NO.

If you had a return to work, you would have signed it.
If you get to the point where they want to issue a stage 2, or even 3, then a decent Rep should get it scrapped as procedure hasn't been followed.
All you'd have to do if they say they want to issue a 2 or 3 is ask for copies of the RTW paperwork regarding each stage, and when they fail to provide it, lodge a written complaint, whether that be a grievance or B&H formal.
HR can advise here.

[Violet1976]

I have had 9 months on on off in past 2 years with an on going condition. O H stated that it would be covered under equality act as ongoing. After first long absence of 6 months I came back to a stage 1 even after O H report stated this. Again more time off and 2 operations. Same process, stage 2 and then 3! Stupid me failed to bring in union and thought manager was covering right procedure. Stage 3 3 meeting consisted of the interviewing manager findinging out there was no paperwork for stage 1 with H R or office manager, stages were wrongly issued as advice from O H had not been taken on board. After my return to work after first absence I felt pushed and bullied to do more than I could. This affected me physically and mentally health. To scared to speak up! After my stage 3 my manager was reprimanded for incorrect protocol and incorrectly issuing stages Aswell as my treatment.I have kept my job but Stages have to now stay on my record ! Would I have a case against royal mail over disability discrimination etc through union legal department.

[UnhappyGremlin]

Very possibly.
It certainly needs looking into.

Speak to your Rep, and also to the Area Rep.

If the Stage 1 was incorrectly issued, then the Stage 2 and 3 were too.

They should all be expunged from your records, and the only reason I can think of that they weren't, is to protect the job of the "manager" who issued them.

Speak to HR. Get copies of your sick record, all paperwork relating to it (Return to Work notes, the Stage notifications that you should have signed and returned and already have a copy of, OHS Assist reports relating to you and this illness - as they will state in them that it is covered by equality act - and if this was failed to be taken into account then it is likely you have been bullied and harassed and discriminated against because of your condition).

It may also be worthwhile ringing the B&H Helpline and asking their advice - explain everything to them.

And from now on, take a Rep into any meetings with you, otherwise they will just bullshit you more.

[Violet1976]

Unhappy Gremlin. I had rep in on my stage 3. This is the outcome of my attendance review from the manager whom did interview:- The attendance agreement was not followed consistently leading to the consideration of dismissal prompt.
No evidence of attendance review 1 in place within the personal file at the parent unit or with HR archives.
No evidence of timely follow up reviews was conducted supporting the employee with ongoing medical conditions.
Only Royal Mail attendance standards were given consideration before the decision was made to issue an attendance review 2.
A lack of consideration was taken in relation to the equality act in line with the Royal mailattendance agreement.
I spoke to rep after this when found out stages had not been cleared. He stated that they would have to stay on my record!
Is this correct???
This is why I want to know we're I can go from here.
Again I have had to go sick due to my condition, which cannot be helped so let's see were I go from here. All I want is these wrongfully issued stages removed. They have put there failings on paper!

[Violet1976]

Unhappy gremlin. I also have all paperwork from HR!!

[UnhappyGremlin]

Have you rung HR and explained this situation?
IF not, do so. If you have, ring them back and ask if they think you have the basis of a formal complaint.
They should advise you accordingly, and independently.
Ensure you have all docs to hand for reference. If your OH Assist reports (in writing, that you should have copies of) clearly state you are covered by the equality act, and your sick leave is only in relation to the same illness, then they have ignored these reports quite obviously.

You could file a grievance, but this is unlikely to succeed.
If what you say happened is true, and I expect it is as I have experience of more than one similar instances like this, then another option is to file a formal complaint for B&H (H1 Form or on the phone with HR) on the grounds that you have been discriminated against due to your recognised illness being covered by the equality act, and this has not been taken into consideration.
You should also make mention that the stage 2 and 3 should not have been issued at all, and that the manager who conducted the stage 3 review/interview should have thrown it all out due to the failure to issue the stage 1, thus not following the correct agreed procedures.

It may also be wise to go above your Rep to the Area rep, or even divisional, and if necessary to HQ.