In my office recently a full time walk was just given to the floater who'd been doing it for a while. So you have the situation where a guy who's been there a couple of years has his own walk (quite a good one too!) while some floaters have been waiting for years and don't even get the chance to apply! Obviously a lot of people aren't too happy about it and I was wondering if the management were within their rights to do this?
I asked my line manager about it and he said it was given 'just because' and that's the end of it. To me it's just lazy management, they couldn't be bothered going through the process of advertising it.
The job is bad enough, but if they stop advertising walks too, there's nothing left!
I'm hoping there's an agreement somewhere that says full time walks MUST be advertised!?
ANNOUNCEMENT : ALL OF ROYAL MAIL'S EMPLOYMENT POLICIES (AGREEMENTS) AT A GLANCE (Updated 2021)... HERE
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Advertising Of Duties
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pinstripe
- Posts: 2473
- Joined: 25 May 2007, 16:42
- Gender: Male
- Location: 2 left turns from reality
In my office all jobs are advertised with everyone (if anyone) interested applying to the Union Rep. The position goes to the most senior applicant, if qualified. If there are no applications the job goes to the least senior reserve. Not sure if this is only my office, but we have a strong union rep and I think he would be following Branch if not National guidelines.
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TrueBlueTerrier
- FORUM ADMINISTRATOR
- Posts: 72671
- Joined: 30 Dec 2006, 10:29
- Gender: Male
- Location: On my couch
I hope this one gets answered as well because I have heard that if you are on a walk for a given amount of time then that duty should be considered as your own. Not sure if this is correct and in any case if the Managers got their act together they should have advertised it before the qualifying time was trigged.
I am just going on to the CWU Site to check.
I am just going on to the CWU Site to check.
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dounome
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POSTMAN
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I was under the impression that a job had to go up within 3 months.
I Wrote-During Covid-Which is still relevant now
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
My BFF Clash
The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
My BFF Clash
The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.
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deadbox
- Posts: 357
- Joined: 27 May 2007, 11:51
Way Forward agreement says......
RESOURCING TO JOBS (F/T AND P/T) THAT DO NOT REQUIRE SELECTION BY SKILLS
14.1 Royal Mail and CWU recognise the need for Royal Mail to have the facility to recruit directly to full-time posts in all operational units. This agreement therefore replaces the relevant provisions of the SFMB and modifies paragraph 3e) of the Agreement on Delivery Issues, accordingly. Both parties also recognise the need to provide employees with the opportunity to change jobs in a way that fulfils their legitimate development aspirations, meets possible personal needs and avoids disruption to service and to customers.
14.2 The principles underpinning the new Resourcing Agreement are set out below.
External recruitment to full-time posts is essential to ensure that RM has the widest choice of candidates from which to select.
Existing and future part-time employees will continue to have opportunities to gain full-time employment locally and further afield.
The filling of posts should result in minimum disruption by ensuring that a full-time vacancy does not trigger a series of moves.
The practice of ‘most senior individual’ will be used when filling non-specialist jobs internally. The only jobs not filled on this basis are specified in Section 15: Selection by Skills.
Jobs advertised externally will be filled on an open resourcing basis and offered to the most suitable person.
14.3 The process for resourcing full-time and part-time, non-specialist posts will comprise one of four options, in the following order, unless agreed locally to change this order:
Internal advertisement of the job within the currently recognised resourcing unit/s.
Deployment of existing surplus employees.
The acceptance of an existing employee from the wider resourcing area or another resourcing area who has previously had his/her name placed on the transfer list for that resourcing unit.
External advertisement.
14.4 Where a full-time post is advertised internally, it will be available to all full-time employees and part-time employees, who have opted for full-time employment, in that resourcing unit. The posts will be filled on the basis of ‘most senior individual’. Where a part-time post is advertised internally, it will be available to all employees as above and filled in the same way.
14.5 The resulting vacancy will be temporarily filled by a reserve, a surplus employee, a transferee from within the wider resourcing area or another resourcing area or by direct recruitment in line with the process above.
14.6 When the number of consequential vacancies in the resourcing unit reaches 5%, or after a period of six months following the last such exercise (if earlier), the posts will be advertised in the resourcing unit, en bloc and filled on the basis of seniority. If this results in any further vacancies, these will be filled, using the same process as above.
14.7 Existing part-time employees, in post at the date of this Agreement, will be asked if they have an interest in full-time employment. A list will be maintained of these employees. Part-time employees on the list will be eligible to apply for internally-advertised posts, alongside full-time employees. They would then pick up the post based on their seniority. If unsuccessful they will be eligible to apply for future jobs advertised internally until appointed.
14.8 Where a full-time vacancy is advertised externally, all part-time staff will be able to express an interest. They will not have a right to the vacancy and will be considered alongside external applicants using the same criteria. Where unsuccessful, the reason will be explained in writing and they will be invited to discuss this with their line manager. They will remain in their current post and will have the opportunity to apply for future externally advertised full-time vacancies.
14.9 Employees taking up internally-advertised posts will be dedicated to them for a minimum of12 months. No applications for job moves will be considered during that period, unless they are:
For specialist posts;
As a result of serious personal or domestic reasons, following discussions with local CWU representatives.
14.10 RM and CWU locally will monitor the operation of this Agreement to ensure that the principles set out above are upheld and that a reasonable balance is secured between the Business need to have greater access to the full-time job changer market and the legitimate interests of existing and future part-time employees.
SELECTION BY SKILLS
15.1 All frontline jobs performed by the new multi-skilled single operational grade will have the same core capabilities. However, it is recognised that there are come jobs that require more specialised skills. An objective selection process will be introduced for these jobs.
15.2 These jobs will be filled by the most senior person who has achieved the right standard for the job during the selection process. Sick attendance and conduct record will only be taken into account where these are relevant to the work. Where training is required by the most senior suitable person, this will be given prior to appointment.
15.3 Resourcing procedures will be based on the Resourcing Area. This will in all cases be the Royal Mail administrative area (i.e. the areas managed by Area Managers, subject to review in the light of any organisational changes). Jobs filled internally will be available to employees currently working in any office within the Area concerned.
15.4 Vacancies for specialist jobs will be advertised throughout the resourcing area. Applications should be made in writing to the Resourcing Unit.
15.5 Employees who wish to be considered for specialist jobs in general should register their interest via the Resourcing Unit or include it in their own Development Plan, a copy of which will be held by the Resourcing Unit (see section 19). This information will be used for training planning. Where a vacancy arises, equal consideration will be given to individuals who have registered their interest through Development Plan or through the Resourcing Unit in writing at the time when the vacancy is advertised. The objective is to allow and maintain openness and fairness in relation to resourcing specialist posts.
15.6 The specific jobs that require specialist skills and which will be subject to selection are:
Resourcing Unit (Bookroom);
DOM Support;
Traffic Office;
Enquiry/Callers’ Office;
Major Customer Collection drivers
(to be jointly defined at National level):
Benefits Agency/Customer Mailroom;
Travelling Post Office;
Leadership roles (formerly PHG ‘A’);
Heavy Goods Vehicle Driving (HGV);
Postbus (PSV);
VCS/MAA;
IMP/MTT;
Advanced TPM;
Non-school training
15.7 All specialist jobs will have consistent job descriptions, which will identify the specialist capabilities and which will be standard throughout Royal Mail.
15.8 Employees who are regarded as suitable should be dedicated to these duties for a minimum of 12 months. If after 12 months the employee wishes to change jobs, they must give adequate notice to enable a suitable trained replacement to be found before release can be allowed. The replacement must be available to take up post no later than six months after notice has been given.
The process for resourcing specialist posts will be one of four options, in the following order, unless agreed locally to change this order:
Deployment of existing surplus employees with the appropriate skills;
Internal advertisement of the job within the resourcing area itself;
The acceptance of an existing employee with the appropriate skills from another resourcing area who has previously had his/her name placed on the transfer list for that resourcing area;
External advertisement.
15.9 This decision will be taken locally, but normally jobs will be filled by internal advertisement, by a surplus employee or a transferee before there is recourse to external advertisement.
15.10 Where a post is advertised internally then it will be advertised to all employees in that resourcing area, full- and part-time. Candidates will undergo an objective selection procedure, designed to assess individual competences against the skills required for a particular job. Where more than one candidate possesses the required capabilities, selection will then be on the basis of seniority.
15.11 The resultant vacancy, be it full- or part-time, will be filled as specified in section 14, unless it too is for a specialist post, in which case the provisions of this section will apply.
14.1 Royal Mail and CWU recognise the need for Royal Mail to have the facility to recruit directly to full-time posts in all operational units. This agreement therefore replaces the relevant provisions of the SFMB and modifies paragraph 3e) of the Agreement on Delivery Issues, accordingly. Both parties also recognise the need to provide employees with the opportunity to change jobs in a way that fulfils their legitimate development aspirations, meets possible personal needs and avoids disruption to service and to customers.
14.2 The principles underpinning the new Resourcing Agreement are set out below.
External recruitment to full-time posts is essential to ensure that RM has the widest choice of candidates from which to select.
Existing and future part-time employees will continue to have opportunities to gain full-time employment locally and further afield.
The filling of posts should result in minimum disruption by ensuring that a full-time vacancy does not trigger a series of moves.
The practice of ‘most senior individual’ will be used when filling non-specialist jobs internally. The only jobs not filled on this basis are specified in Section 15: Selection by Skills.
Jobs advertised externally will be filled on an open resourcing basis and offered to the most suitable person.
14.3 The process for resourcing full-time and part-time, non-specialist posts will comprise one of four options, in the following order, unless agreed locally to change this order:
Internal advertisement of the job within the currently recognised resourcing unit/s.
Deployment of existing surplus employees.
The acceptance of an existing employee from the wider resourcing area or another resourcing area who has previously had his/her name placed on the transfer list for that resourcing unit.
External advertisement.
14.4 Where a full-time post is advertised internally, it will be available to all full-time employees and part-time employees, who have opted for full-time employment, in that resourcing unit. The posts will be filled on the basis of ‘most senior individual’. Where a part-time post is advertised internally, it will be available to all employees as above and filled in the same way.
14.5 The resulting vacancy will be temporarily filled by a reserve, a surplus employee, a transferee from within the wider resourcing area or another resourcing area or by direct recruitment in line with the process above.
14.6 When the number of consequential vacancies in the resourcing unit reaches 5%, or after a period of six months following the last such exercise (if earlier), the posts will be advertised in the resourcing unit, en bloc and filled on the basis of seniority. If this results in any further vacancies, these will be filled, using the same process as above.
14.7 Existing part-time employees, in post at the date of this Agreement, will be asked if they have an interest in full-time employment. A list will be maintained of these employees. Part-time employees on the list will be eligible to apply for internally-advertised posts, alongside full-time employees. They would then pick up the post based on their seniority. If unsuccessful they will be eligible to apply for future jobs advertised internally until appointed.
14.8 Where a full-time vacancy is advertised externally, all part-time staff will be able to express an interest. They will not have a right to the vacancy and will be considered alongside external applicants using the same criteria. Where unsuccessful, the reason will be explained in writing and they will be invited to discuss this with their line manager. They will remain in their current post and will have the opportunity to apply for future externally advertised full-time vacancies.
14.9 Employees taking up internally-advertised posts will be dedicated to them for a minimum of12 months. No applications for job moves will be considered during that period, unless they are:
For specialist posts;
As a result of serious personal or domestic reasons, following discussions with local CWU representatives.
14.10 RM and CWU locally will monitor the operation of this Agreement to ensure that the principles set out above are upheld and that a reasonable balance is secured between the Business need to have greater access to the full-time job changer market and the legitimate interests of existing and future part-time employees.
SELECTION BY SKILLS
15.1 All frontline jobs performed by the new multi-skilled single operational grade will have the same core capabilities. However, it is recognised that there are come jobs that require more specialised skills. An objective selection process will be introduced for these jobs.
15.2 These jobs will be filled by the most senior person who has achieved the right standard for the job during the selection process. Sick attendance and conduct record will only be taken into account where these are relevant to the work. Where training is required by the most senior suitable person, this will be given prior to appointment.
15.3 Resourcing procedures will be based on the Resourcing Area. This will in all cases be the Royal Mail administrative area (i.e. the areas managed by Area Managers, subject to review in the light of any organisational changes). Jobs filled internally will be available to employees currently working in any office within the Area concerned.
15.4 Vacancies for specialist jobs will be advertised throughout the resourcing area. Applications should be made in writing to the Resourcing Unit.
15.5 Employees who wish to be considered for specialist jobs in general should register their interest via the Resourcing Unit or include it in their own Development Plan, a copy of which will be held by the Resourcing Unit (see section 19). This information will be used for training planning. Where a vacancy arises, equal consideration will be given to individuals who have registered their interest through Development Plan or through the Resourcing Unit in writing at the time when the vacancy is advertised. The objective is to allow and maintain openness and fairness in relation to resourcing specialist posts.
15.6 The specific jobs that require specialist skills and which will be subject to selection are:
Resourcing Unit (Bookroom);
DOM Support;
Traffic Office;
Enquiry/Callers’ Office;
Major Customer Collection drivers
(to be jointly defined at National level):
Benefits Agency/Customer Mailroom;
Travelling Post Office;
Leadership roles (formerly PHG ‘A’);
Heavy Goods Vehicle Driving (HGV);
Postbus (PSV);
VCS/MAA;
IMP/MTT;
Advanced TPM;
Non-school training
15.7 All specialist jobs will have consistent job descriptions, which will identify the specialist capabilities and which will be standard throughout Royal Mail.
15.8 Employees who are regarded as suitable should be dedicated to these duties for a minimum of 12 months. If after 12 months the employee wishes to change jobs, they must give adequate notice to enable a suitable trained replacement to be found before release can be allowed. The replacement must be available to take up post no later than six months after notice has been given.
The process for resourcing specialist posts will be one of four options, in the following order, unless agreed locally to change this order:
Deployment of existing surplus employees with the appropriate skills;
Internal advertisement of the job within the resourcing area itself;
The acceptance of an existing employee with the appropriate skills from another resourcing area who has previously had his/her name placed on the transfer list for that resourcing area;
External advertisement.
15.9 This decision will be taken locally, but normally jobs will be filled by internal advertisement, by a surplus employee or a transferee before there is recourse to external advertisement.
15.10 Where a post is advertised internally then it will be advertised to all employees in that resourcing area, full- and part-time. Candidates will undergo an objective selection procedure, designed to assess individual competences against the skills required for a particular job. Where more than one candidate possesses the required capabilities, selection will then be on the basis of seniority.
15.11 The resultant vacancy, be it full- or part-time, will be filled as specified in section 14, unless it too is for a specialist post, in which case the provisions of this section will apply.
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FellChair
- Posts: 73
- Joined: 29 Aug 2007, 13:21
- Location: East Midlands
The walk in question was vacant for about 12 months before being 'given' away. At one stage it was advertised but nobody was allocated it as the section needed a part time walk. Anyway another duty was made part time but that particular walk remained vacant until recently. I'll have a word with the rep tomorrow, it's a big office so I'm not sure he's aware of it!
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maddog
- Posts: 5
- Joined: 18 Aug 2007, 18:51
TrueBlueTerrier wrote:I hope this one gets answered as well because I have heard that if you are on a walk for a given amount of time then that duty should be considered as your own. Not sure if this is correct and in any case if the Managers got their act together they should have advertised it before the qualifying time was trigged.
I am just going on to the CWU Site to check.
I was doing a rural duty for nearly three years while the post holder was acting line manager, soon as he had had enough of being the Doms whipping boy he was allowed to take up his old post and I was relegated to the reserves again.-
dvbuk55
- EX ROYAL MAIL
- Posts: 16650
- Joined: 02 Jun 2007, 19:17
- Gender: Male
Regardless of anyone acting outside their normal role, ie sabbatical, maternity/extended maternity/ - then they would pick a duty within their normal workplace and maintain that position until such time as it was deemed to be vacated.maddog wrote:TrueBlueTerrier wrote:I hope this one gets answered as well because I have heard that if you are on a walk for a given amount of time then that duty should be considered as your own. Not sure if this is correct and in any case if the Managers got their act together they should have advertised it before the qualifying time was trigged.
I am just going on to the CWU Site to check.