North London Delivery revisions

[ronpetetrevchris]

I can't believe this thread, it appears to me that London are organised and must have good Rep's

No it doesn't.
It means the offices are overstaffed but the business doesn't want to pay to remove that surplus. (130 surplus at the Mount was it as well?)
Mr Dingo himself told us that it takes the business 3 years to recoup the money from EVR.
And they would still have to recruit p/t staff to ensure they had enough bodies to cover the duties.
He has also told us that they have had plenty of VRs. (It almost sounded like he was gloating about the number of duties they had lost.)
A move to a performance standard that you or I might reasonably be expected to achieve would cost the business too much so they are playing a game where the business (for now) allows them to remain inefficient because that costs less and Mr Dingo can crow about how organised and strong his area is.
I have never been so ashamed to call myself a member of the CWU.

So London dosent have a clue what the rest of us are going through? Well done CWU for stopping the two tier workforce.

[dvbuk55]

I can't believe this thread, it appears to me that London are organised and must have good Rep's

No it doesn't.
It means the offices are overstaffed but the business doesn't want to pay to remove that surplus. (130 surplus at the Mount was it as well?)
Mr Dingo himself told us that it takes the business 3 years to recoup the money from EVR.
And they would still have to recruit p/t staff to ensure they had enough bodies to cover the duties.
He has also told us that they have had plenty of VRs. (It almost sounded like he was gloating about the number of duties they had lost.)
A move to a performance standard that you or I might reasonably be expected to achieve would cost the business too much so they are playing a game where the business (for now) allows them to remain inefficient because that costs less and Mr Dingo can crow about how organised and strong his area is.
I have never been so ashamed to call myself a member of the CWU.

So London dosent have a clue what the rest of us are going through? Well done CWU for stopping the two tier workforce.

Do you seriously think they give a crap?

[hampshireman]

sorry chaps i think this is now going to far, we are slagging off our own members this is a time when we need stay strong as a union. we may not all agree in what is happening at headquaters and the way this deal has been produced to the members but we now need to get this sorted or we will distroy our own union.if members are not happy in whats happening this should be solved by the ballot everyone has there own opinions on this agreement and should have there say,but to start saying union members are middle management is wrong in so may ways.
everyone knows how i will be voting and have been against the 2010 agreement + this agreement and my own office revisions since day one but if out voted i will go arguing my case.
this was an national agreement to vote on not just an agreement for certain areas,until this agreement solves many problems in delivery nationally i will be voting no and so will other delivery staff in north london.
the main thing is that all delivery staff vote and not leave it for everyone else, money dont solve everthing.

Dingo is the one that has gone too far with this thread, rubbing people's faces in it and gloating over the p*ss takes they call revisions in London. It's also very very clear from his posts that the CWU will no longer be a national union, it's every office for themselves and if you're not a strong office then tough sh*t you're getting shafted and it's all your own fault.

I'm just glad I haven't paid any subs since 2010 and won't be doing ever again.

Whether you agree or not with Dingo.. You should take his point that london have gor 'better deals' with revisions.

Now ask why is that?

Comfortable or not; it's because they stand their ground or negotiate better. Don't feel bitter ; just adopt the same approach

[fishtank]

Don't feel bitter ; just adopt the same approach

Only if you can convince the business to adopt the same approach with the rest of the country as it does with London.

[OnAFlyer]

sorry chaps i think this is now going to far, we are slagging off our own members this is a time when we need stay strong as a union. we may not all agree in what is happening at headquaters and the way this deal has been produced to the members but we now need to get this sorted or we will distroy our own union.if members are not happy in whats happening this should be solved by the ballot everyone has there own opinions on this agreement and should have there say,but to start saying union members are middle management is wrong in so may ways.
everyone knows how i will be voting and have been against the 2010 agreement + this agreement and my own office revisions since day one but if out voted i will go arguing my case.
this was an national agreement to vote on not just an agreement for certain areas,until this agreement solves many problems in delivery nationally i will be voting no and so will other delivery staff in north london.
the main thing is that all delivery staff vote and not leave it for everyone else, money dont solve everthing.

Dingo is the one that has gone too far with this thread, rubbing people's faces in it and gloating over the p*ss takes they call revisions in London. It's also very very clear from his posts that the CWU will no longer be a national union, it's every office for themselves and if you're not a strong office then tough sh*t you're getting shafted and it's all your own fault.

I'm just glad I haven't paid any subs since 2010 and won't be doing ever again.

Whether you agree or not with Dingo.. You should take his point that london have gor 'better deals' with revisions.

Now ask why is that?

Comfortable or not; it's because they stand their ground or negotiate better. Don't feel bitter ; just adopt the same approach

The thing is, I would class our revision as a success, nobody really goes over much unless it's a really busy period and managers don't bully or harass if we want to cut off.

I'm pretty happy with my workload, it's relatively easily achievable most weeks.

However

We are working at 100bsi (I think it may actually be over that) and the DSM is chasing us for more hours because we aren't failing. I can't even imagine how easy a 66bsi office must be, and they're not being constantly chased up for more hours out?

No wonder RM is saying there are cuts to be made in delivery, the poor sods in here working late, cutting off and struggling yet all along thousands of their workmates are taking the p*ss on a daily basis and getting away with it. And all backed by the 'national' union.

[hampshireman]

Don't feel bitter ; just adopt the same approach

Only if you can convince the business to adopt the same approach with the rest of the country as it does with London.

I agree.

But.... We had a brief meeting today with the ARea Rep.. He made many salient points .. half the members walked away to their frames to continue to prep!!!

Now , if you were in london (and I am not) , would that have happened?

That was my point really . If you don't back up the Union ; if you don't stand together ; then you are f**ked.

BTW ; we have Summer Lapsing / Absorbtion from next week!!!

[OnAFlyer]

Don't feel bitter ; just adopt the same approach

Only if you can convince the business to adopt the same approach with the rest of the country as it does with London.

I agree.

But.... We had a brief meeting today with the ARea Rep.. He made many salient points .. half the members walked away to their frames to continue to prep!!!

Now , if you were in london (and I am not) , would that have happened?

That was my point really . If you don't back up the Union ; if you don't stand together ; then you are f**ked.

BTW ; we have Summer Lapsing / Absorbtion from next week!!!

Even if all your members stood up for each other, do you think you'd get anywhere near 66bsi in a revision? We could have stood there all week and RM would have laughed in our faces as we were already working far higher than that.
Btw, we've been lapsing since new year week.

[silly suffolk]

Don't feel bitter ; just adopt the same approach

Only if you can convince the business to adopt the same approach with the rest of the country as it does with London.

take un official action at the drop of a hat, and elect some right bolshie buggers into positions of influence. perhaps then the business will take note what happens in the shires and beyond. and perhaps if mail being disrupted in the square mile can be replicated and have the same effect where you live you might have a shout.

[fishtank]

Now , if you were in london (and I am not) , would that have happened?

If they were in London they probably wouldn't feel the need to go back to prepping.
It's a chicken and egg scenario, If members feel isolated and disengaged they will pay little attention to union meetings, why would they when they see very little positive coming from them?
If you don't engage the membership this is the inevitable outcome, then if you're really stupid you stick your head in the sand and point the finger at the members which leads to...more disengaged members.

Simple question...What possible positive can come from blaming the membership?

[dvbuk55]

Simple question...What possible positive can come from blaming the membership?

Well a couple of things really, when in doubt blame someone else to justify your huge salary and agree to anything as long as it doesn't involve yourself.

[motherhubbard]

It's because they stand their ground or negotiate better.

No it isn't.
Do you think with these revisions all cars have been removed from delivery?
Everyone is using the designated equipment for their walk?
Everyone is working all their paid hours and there is no more ghost docket?
I doubt it.

Has the main objective of a trade union become the defence of the workshy and feckless?
When did poor performance become a trade union value to be trumpeted?

[hampshireman]

It's because they stand their ground or negotiate better.

No it isn't.
Do you think with these revisions all cars have been removed from delivery?
Everyone is using the designated equipment for their walk?
Everyone is working all their paid hours and there is no more ghost docket?
I doubt it.

Has the main objective of a trade union become the defence of the workshy and feckless?
When did poor performance become a trade union value to be trumpeted?

You are missing the point. (or maybe I don't get the point across - my apologies)

The point being ; that if London can get the deal that they want , then why can't others. Are London stronger oir are other areas weaker?

Maybe the point is moot ?

And I do take on other points and comments as to what the Union is doing for the Members..

And I'm now rambling as I am knackered after my Delivery :)

[chrisj]

Sorry, I think you are missing some of the points...

You can see that from the list some offices are far more efficient than others... Why?

So it is perhaps unfair to lump all of them together but that is dingo's fault for making the argument 'us' and 'them'. It will be interesting to see about some other offices in London - some will be even less efficient, I guess.

The most important point you are missing is that some of the London offices have a far stronger hand to bargain with because of their history, composition of their workforce (FT numbers), the actual number of staff (they have surplus staff) in an office and so on. I think their location (capital city) might also be relevant...

If you work in an isolated office somewhere else in the country - you will struggle to get such a good deal esp with efficiency/performance levels and saturdays off: it will matter very little how strong you members are. Unless, you will be walking almost every other week but then they will pick off the ring leaders - and that is already happening...

Having said the above, if all Divisional Rep are as involved and concerned about their members as dingo is (he appears very good and through and knows almost every single office well) then the rest of the offices struggling might be better - we are not talking equal...

I suppose the members are also strong in London but why would you not be strong if you know that you can get away with more by sticking together. In the office where the efficiency level is 66%; you can bet that some will be at below 50% and some will be at about 75% but that is still better than 100% - so they are all still better off by sticking together.

* It is not that some in the other not-so-strong offices are also not getting away with it compared to other colleagues but the selfishness and self-centred attitude of some is not helping the collective.

It is up to RM to sort the inefficient offices out but it is nothing to crow about; and their fortunate position should not be used to blame others and/or pretend that some offices are really having a hard time.

[motherhubbard]

You are missing the point. (or maybe I don't get the point across - my apologies)
The point being ; that if London can get the deal that they want , then why can't others. Are London stronger or are other areas weaker?

London got the deal they got because nobody can come up with a cost effective way of dealing with the surplus.
Nothing to do with strength. Nothing to do with good reps. Nothing to do with unity.

[woofwoof]

Well done London you used the agreements to the max as for us f***ers in hull well we got f***ing shafted be that from area ,division or hq