Failure

Post by **SpacePhoenix** » 17 Feb 2017, 09:09

ddtc wrote:One of the managers have said that there is a new rule that allows mail to be left if it cannot be covered. Does this sound right to you?

Ask for that in writing from that manager

Post by **Lincox** » 17 Feb 2017, 16:03

Wilful delay is when you have brought mail back and have not followed the Royal Mail/CWU guidelines and agreements in respect of the Overrunning Deliveries Procedures.
The regulations state that you must inform your manager at the earliest possible time, once you feel that you will be unable to complete within your contracted hours, and before you leave the delivery office. You state that this is what happened and you have witnesses to prove that this happened. It is then for the manager to MANAGE the situation from that point. He should look at the inward mail/packets records for that day and make an assessment as to whether it is feasible for you to complete your walk within the allotted time and you have the right to inspect those records before setting out on delivery. If you do not agree with his assessment then he should arrange a time for either of you to contact each other, sometime within an hour of your contracted completion time, to assess whether you will be able to complete the delivery. At that point you inform him of the work still to be completed and your estimate of how long that will take. If this takes beyond your normal completion time and you are not prepared to stay beyond that point then the manager must MANAGE the situation and advise you how he wishes to proceed. He cannot bully you in to completing.
You have therefore conformed to all of the agreements that are in place and he has not. You should therefore not worry and any decent Union Rep will have any charges of wilful delay thrown at you quashed at the initial meeting.

walkthewalk · Post by **walkthewalk** » 17 Feb 2017, 16:37

I reckon this meeting will not take place at all, if it was a witch hunt you would have been suspended and I know it sounds easy to say but don't worry I've heard of many worse cases with nothing said. You'll be fine mate.

ddtc · Post by **ddtc** » 21 Feb 2017, 21:26

This meeting has already took place, obviously there are other details I have left out so not to make it obvious who I am. End of I maybe done for wilful delay. Can't believe it, nor any of my colleagues.

I stand by that I did the job correctly and I had a workload that exceeded my contracted time.

Keep hearing swings and round abouts bs, flexing, traffic volumes etc.

I have now been off a few days as it has hit me. I am stressed and can't understand why its happening. Their have been other colleagues who couldn't finish and brought stuff back, even our rep did and nothing happened. Some even got paid extra and completed well within their contracted time.

I feel they are targetting me as I did not want to go over at christmas time so now they are making an example out of me.

Post by **Lincox** » 21 Feb 2017, 21:55

Forget the swings and roundabouts, flexing, it does not apply on an individual basis and can only be REQUESTED for unforeseen circumstances such as bulk mail van braking down/ delayed mail, and the management must take in to account individual circumstances.
Were you represented at the meeting by your local rep? Did you provide witness statements confirming that you reported to your manager that you would be unable to complete and that you did this prior to leaving the delivery office?

ddtc · Post by **ddtc** » 21 Feb 2017, 22:19

Yes, done everything as I think I should of and yes union is looking into it. As for witnesses, everyone noticed nearly a full walk leftover and the management coming over a couple times when I said I couldn't finish. All the mention of swings, flex were quickly dismissed by the rep.

Newbie001 · Post by **Newbie001** » 21 Feb 2017, 22:29

The over-running procedure is not fit for purpose. I mean you've got to stand and argue with manager about traffic figures. Get witnesses. Speak to rep. Phone manager before u finish. All because you want to finish on
your time. And still run risk of getting done for wilful delay anyway.
Union needs to come up with different way to protect its members. Maybe a form that posties can fill in if unable/ willing to complete. 1 part goes to area rep, 1 part to manager. Stop all bullying and harrassment in one step.

Post by **Lincox** » 22 Feb 2017, 10:50

I would not worry DTTC. They do not have a leg to stand on as far as wilful delay is concerned. I will be extremely surprised if they take this further, but then again this is Royal Mail. If they do and it goes to appeal, you will be represented at a higher level than local rep. and it should get overturned.

ddtc · Post by **ddtc** » 22 Feb 2017, 14:52

Lincox wrote:I would not worry DTTC. They do not have a leg to stand on as far as wilful delay is concerned. I will be extremely surprised if they take this further, but then again this is Royal Mail. If they do and it goes to appeal, you will be represented at a higher level than local rep. and it should get overturned.

Thanks lincox, I'm trying my best to not let it stress me. It just really baffles me why they are doing this.

fishtank · Post by **fishtank** » 22 Feb 2017, 15:13

ddtc wrote:
Lincox wrote:I would not worry DTTC. They do not have a leg to stand on as far as wilful delay is concerned. I will be extremely surprised if they take this further, but then again this is Royal Mail. If they do and it goes to appeal, you will be represented at a higher level than local rep. and it should get overturned.
Thanks lincox, I'm trying my best to not let it stress me. It just really baffles me why they are doing this.

They are doing it to make an example of you to let the rest of the office know just how big and tough they are, as in most of these cases they've overestimated their own intelligence. On the whole our managers couldn't follow the procedure with a map, a satnav and a local guide, get your branch involved if you haven't already, get everyone you can involved, that's what they are there for.

This business is seriously screwed with these idiots in charge. It's the one thing that's never been "modernised" in this business, the piss poor level of frontline management.

postslippete · Post by **postslippete** » 22 Feb 2017, 17:29

Were there any witnesses present when you informed your manager that you were unable to complete?? You don't mention if you had a van share partner??

Always best to get your ass covered at all times when you employ the overrunning procedure.

ddtc · Post by **ddtc** » 22 Feb 2017, 20:10

Well area rep contacted me and they are fuming.

They said exactly what I said about the walk failed the day before and so it is not my fault and not to worry.

Just got to wait and see, I'll feel better once I know if I'm alright.

South_London_Postie · Post by **South_London_Postie** » 22 Feb 2017, 20:45

I know it is easy to say, but honestly don't worry. You followed the procedure set out by the company.

I am sure all will come good.

postslippete · Post by **postslippete** » 23 Feb 2017, 16:08

I wouldn't be in the least bit surprised if your line manager got a b*llocking for this

In our office, if the duties cannot be completed and there is no one available to work it then the manager has to go and do it. They are ultimately responsible for the USO of the section.

It seems to me that there are still a lot of offices out there that still employ work-shy managers and that is NOT what the business wants. Don't be surprised if you see some of these managers leaving the business in the next few years either through stress or by other means.

steve1873 · Post by **steve1873** » 23 Feb 2017, 18:58

Newbie001 wrote:The over-running procedure is not fit for purpose. I mean you've got to stand and argue with manager about traffic figures. Get witnesses. Speak to rep. Phone manager before u finish. All because you want to finish on
your time. And still run risk of getting done for wilful delay anyway.
Union needs to come up with different way to protect its members. Maybe a form that posties can fill in if unable/ willing to complete. 1 part goes to area rep, 1 part to manager. Stop all bullying and harrassment in one step.

100% in agreement, it is unfit for purpose and is actively used and abused by bullying management as to their interpretation.