Walk Away From The Union That Is Destroying You

[noggin1969]

[dvbuk55]

Locker Dave seems to be obsessed with us poor posties - do you think it's an OCD thing or is he just gay.

Why would his sexuality be important......we are a bi-gender organisation after all.

Sexuality? I just thought he might be a happy chappie trying to protect us Also could you define bi-gender - I am definitely not into kinky stuff tbt - just to set the record straight..................no pun intended.

[daveyeff]

absolutely spot on. cos thats EXACTLY what he is.,,,,,could be gay as well.

[Ahebban]

If CWU members continue to walk away from their union, the long-term winner will be Royal Mail for sure. Each member lost (for whatever reason) and each new employee not joining signals to RM that their current strategy is working and will continue with impunity in the face of a lacklustre CWU leadership. Less union members mean the fight to retain let alone improve on current terms and conditions becomes ever more difficult. If the foundation of the union (its members) crumbles it matters not who is at the top as they will surely perish along with its members (unless they jump ship and join the RM board of course ).

The strength of any union is its members. It is the responsibility of Div Reps and above to hear the voice of the members, attend Branch meetings etc, recognise the needs of its members first and foremost, and not find itself bound to a flawed agreement (BT 2010) that RM use and abuse with impunity as and when it suits. It has taken far too long to sort out crucial elements of BT2010 with mail centres and delivery offices having suffered as a consequence. CWU HQ make the same mistake time after time, agreeing 'Joint Statements' etc, which are worthless at local rep level as the content is mere words, nothing of substance, no figures etc with which to counter the onslaught. Even at this late stage the Delivery Method Revision process is still being negotiated at a snail's pace and delivery offices are suffering as a consequence because members are lacking leadership where it matters and the tools with which to confront management. The process of making information available to local offices through 'training' DMR Trainers etc is still not fully in place with the current agreement ending in 6 months!

Yes, we need national agreements with RM, but we need one's that the membership can relate too and understand! We are coming up to a period where the membership will be looking to HQ to learn the painful lessons of BT 2010. To negotiate a short-term agreement (12 months) that can be built upon year on year. Take away all the flannel, aims and aspirations nonsense and agree to nothing until facts, figures, achievable timetables etc are part and parcel of the next Agreement.

[postypie]

Show me a viable alternative matey.....if not then pipe down cos the CWU have never really let me down as of yet!

[dvbuk55]

If CWU members continue to walk away from their union, the long-term winner will be Royal Mail for sure. Each member lost (for whatever reason) and each new employee not joining signals to RM that their current strategy is working and will continue with impunity in the face of a lacklustre CWU leadership. Less union members mean the fight to retain let alone improve on current terms and conditions becomes ever more difficult. If the foundation of the union (its members) crumbles it matters not who is at the top as they will surely perish along with its members (unless they jump ship and join the RM board of course ).

The strength of any union is its members. It is the responsibility of Div Reps and above to hear the voice of the members, attend Branch meetings etc, recognise the needs of its members first and foremost, and not find itself bound to a flawed agreement (BT 2010) that RM use and abuse with impunity as and when it suits. It has taken far too long to sort out crucial elements of BT2010 with mail centres and delivery offices having suffered as a consequence. CWU HQ make the same mistake time after time, agreeing 'Joint Statements' etc, which are worthless at local rep level as the content is mere words, nothing of substance, no figures etc with which to counter the onslaught. Even at this late stage the Delivery Method Revision process is still being negotiated at a snail's pace and delivery offices are suffering as a consequence because members are lacking leadership where it matters and the tools with which to confront management. The process of making information available to local offices through 'training' DMR Trainers etc is still not fully in place with the current agreement ending in 6 months!

Yes, we need national agreements with RM, but we need one's that the membership can relate too and understand! We are coming up to a period where the membership will be looking to HQ to learn the painful lessons of BT 2010. To negotiate a short-term agreement (12 months) that can be built upon year on year. Take away all the flannel, aims and aspirations nonsense and agree to nothing until facts, figures, achievable timetables etc are part and parcel of the next Agreement.

Probably the most incisive post I have seen in a long long time. Despite intelligent criticism the union insist on backing a busted flush and then have the gall to ask those who have suffered the most from this agreement to back them. They need to rebuild a working relationship with the members first. IMHO it's all too political and I have serious reservations about this leaderships commitment and ability.

[dvbuk55]

Show me a viable alternative matey.....if not then pipe down cos the CWU have never really let me down as of yet!

Are you talking about the last 2 minutes? A viable alternative would be to negotiate in favour of the members, a viable alternative would be to adress the bullying since BT2010, a viable alternative would be to revisit 2010 and finally put it to rest.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Also could you define bi-gender

It has 2 meanings:

adj. Having two genders simultaneously, e.g. both male and female.

adj. Having a tendency to move between feminine and masculine gender-typed behaviour depending on context.

[dvbuk55]

Also could you define bi-gender

It has 2 meanings:

adj. Having two genders simultaneously, e.g. both male and female.

adj. Having a tendency to move between feminine and masculine gender-typed behaviour depending on context.

Now I did say I wasn't into kinky stuff and that reads a bit like a threesome

[Judgee]

How can you say we get nothing for our union fees? We do get a diary every year!

On a more serious note. Having a crap union is still better than no union at all. I'm sure when we get privatised the new owners will try and get rid of the union altogether. By hook or by crook I'm damn sure they will try. Be careful what you wish for, if we lose the union (poorly run as it may be), you are in for a big wake up call believe me!

[Martin Walsh]

The CWU is an amalgamation of three unions , the UCW , NCU and the POEU.

The postal union which was the UPW and the then UCW has always been a de-centralised union. The power has always been in the Branch`s and the members. The problem has always been that some Branch`s , reps and members are more organised and are willing to stand up for themselves then others.

Whilst clearly most like to blame CWU HQs for all the ills of their working life, the reality is that there are so many issues where if you did not have a union you would be far worse off. Lets think of a few , Paid Meal reliefs , MTSF pay protection , shift allowances , pensionable pay including all you pension up to 2008 protected against final salary , reserved rights payments , RRIS payments , professional drivers money , reserve rights payment for ex bonus schemes including the £100 christmas bonus , annual pay rises , TPM money , protection against complusory redunancy , an additional payment which goes up with payrises for working in a delivery office to the same hours as you preivously did. Uniform , the right to patentity and maternity leave well over the normal limits , the right to annual leave up too 6 weeks and with the opportunity to pruchase annual leave, scottish distant island allowance , London Weighting , over time rates , SA rates , death in service which the union got , VR terms , ill health terms , sick pay over the national aveage, seniority , time bonus to name just a few , lump sum money etc.

Do you really think that if there was not a union or if the union was destroyed it would take Royal Mail very long to remove a lot of the above ??

Yes I am happy to take some responsibilty for the union needing to improve. Headquarters should also take responsiblity and critcism on the chin. We need to listen and re-engage in the workplace with the members. However we all know that sometimes what the members want is not always either acheiveable or right as some simply want to chase time.

However if i am able to take it on the chin and Headqaurters are then some on here and in the workplace should also take a close hard look at themselves and say if a manager wants to introduce something which you dont agree with and you also dont agree with the area rep then you and your colleagues have a responsiblity to say no we not having it and we not accpeting bullying in the workplace.

I dont get it how someone can come on here and complain about whats happening in their workplace but cannot organise the office to stop it.

So I am willing to help change things and believe it is the right way forward but some of you also need to think that you are the union in the workplace and if you stand together you become more powerful.

Without a union your job will get an hell of a lot worse.

[Ahebban]

Show me a viable alternative matey.....if not then pipe down cos the CWU have never really let me down as of yet!

I am not suggesting an alternative to CWU. In many respects the CWU are faultless in the manner they address issues. Other examples are found within health and safety, equality policy, commitment and support of anti-racism and support of trade unionists abroad is second to none.

It is with this particular agreement (BT 2010) that CWU leadership have been second-best to RM all along and which has led to so much disillusion among members. I appreciate the CWU leadership were under immense pressure 'to do a deal' at the time to get members to return to work in order that christmas would not be cancelled. But to arrive at BT2010 as the recommended product was nothing short of capitulation by the leadership. I did not expect a return to the 'good old days', neither did I expect to see an agreement akin to 'War and Peace' in its word count and lacking in substance in crucial areas!

As I said in my earlier post, my real concern is that we are still caught in this endless cycle of meetings, producing joint statements which are then ignored as it suits RM. We need a fresh approach and to stop playing 'nice' otherwise RM will not sign up to any new agreement come March 2013. It is to their advantage that we continue on their present course leaving our leadership toothless and members fighting a losing battle at local level.

[Ahebban]

Unfortunately, members pay their subscription and they DO expect their problems resolved for them with minimal input on their part. Selfish? - Yes, of course it is, but that is the way of things now.

Local Reps are very often a lone voice in opposing what management propose in an office and RM expolit that to their advantage. Almost impossible to set up Work Committees etc as no-one wants to be seen as being even part-responsible for decisions that colleagues won't like. I speak with other Reps at Section/Branch meetings and they are saying the same about their own offices. The members will always look to its leadership for guidance, seek focus on a particular issue that will unite members, and HQ has yet to convince on that front.

The CWU has done much in its past to ensure that members' terms and conditions are the envy of many, whatever members may think. Clearly, we are not in the ascendency now and member apathy is a growing concern for all and it needs to be turned around quickly otherwise those benefits will disappear - as alluded to by Dingo!

Is there are 'quick-fix' solution? Maybe not one that will commit members as yet, however, passive discussions with RM, standing still and reminiscing on past glories is certainly not the way forward. With privatisation looming there is little time for the CWU to pull itself together and unite members for the coming battles.

[dvbuk55]

Privatisation? Now who thinks that the CWU has a realistic approach to fighting it's corner? Especially if seats on the board are offered as reported previously and I hope there is not a defence of that as some sort of talisman to look after the members interests. It seems to be trotted out, just like the pension was, as the bogeyman but when it came to hey lads hey, we didn't get the promised vote on it and the fight was non-existent and that HAD to be led from the front.

[pcb]

The membership had its chance to fight privatisation and a hardcore carried the fight but the majority of people would not give up their own time to join in the demos called for by the leadership. So here we are with ConDem government set to privatise our workplace and you still give no viable way forward!