problems with booking annual leave.

[sharpie1181]

Hi, I am a relative newcomer to royal mail, I started in June 2014.

I have been trying to book some annual leave for a while with my manager, to no avail. I was looking to book a week off between Xmas and the end of the holiday year in order to go on my only family holiday of the year. The last holiday I took was honoured from before my eemployment began and I have never had to book holiday at royal mail. I began to ask about this in October and have been trying to chase her up since then. I am part time I probably only catch sight of my manager once a week if im lucky. Every single time I have asked her about booking some leave she has given me one excuse or another and during Xmas pressure it was impossible to get 5 mins of her time.

I eventually tracked her down today after completing my walk, and she tells me that I wont be able to take my remaining holiday as 'there isnt any holiday left'.

I still have around 2 weeks left to take and as far as I am aware if she doesn't allow me to take my holiday she will be breaking the law.

She has also told me that there are other people more senior to me who still have holiday left to take, and she has to book them before me as a result of their seniority, however surely this should not result in me loosing 2 weeks of holiday and could even be described as 'discrimination'

Has anyone else encountered similar problems? If so any ideas on the correct action I should take?

I am currently not in the union, if I join now would they help me with this before the end of the holiday year?

[lala]

What a shambles.. Are you in the union? If so, get your rep onto it.

Its not your fault they cant resource properly. You are entitled to time off work.

[Darren Bent]

Joining the union would help, as you will have a rep which will help you to fight the battle for you, if he/she is any good. Lot of people in Royal Mail have problem with holiday system for different reasons. If your line manager is not any good, try to speak to the DOM of the office to see if she/he can sort it out for you.

[baldrick]

I still have around 2 weeks left to take and as far as I am aware if she doesn't allow me to take my holiday she will be breaking the law.

I am currently not in the union, if I join now would they help me with this before the end of the holiday year?

Firstly it would be best to join the CWU. If your rep is any good he/she will be able to help you.
But you should not lose any leave you are due. You are right that you should be able to take any AL you are entitled to under the EU Working Time legislation. Up to five days can be carried over into the next AL year, if both you and your manager agree, in writing. You should get at least the remaining leave in the current AL year.

[mobydick1974]

Its amazing how many people only join the union when they need us... I bet most of the time its the old story of... I don't need to be a member...what can they do for me...waste of money...blah blah blah.
My opinion is that this is a issue which has accrued before becoming a member so he should not be represented this time round.
No good locking the barn door when the horse has bolted.

[korky]

it is against the law for them to refuse your entitlement, and (i think) the max you can carry forward is 3 days, maybe 3 1/2
if you don't go the union way you could always give acas a ring to explain you have 100% refused and see what they advise
http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=4303" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

i think i've still got about 4 left but in no rush, though its usually reserves who get shat on due to an extra 7 or 8 days added to the previous years excess to fit in, which they're refused!

[fishtank]

My opinion is that this is a issue which has accrued before becoming a member so he should not be represented this time round.
No good locking the barn door when the horse has bolted.

No good cutting off your nose to spite your face.
My opinion is that you don't recruit members by hanging them out to dry, The union needs every member it can get, I don't care how or why they come to us, just that they do.

[mobydick1974]

My opinion is that this is a issue which has accrued before becoming a member so he should not be represented this time round.
No good locking the barn door when the horse has bolted.

No good cutting off your nose to spite your face.
My opinion is that you don't recruit members by hanging them out to dry, The union needs every member it can get, I don't care how or why they come to us, just that they do.

Hang them out to dry.... I always go round my office every month and ask non members if they wish to join, they have a choice. I also tell them if the s**t hits the fan then don't come running to the cwu, we don't back date problems, we offer you protection once your a member...its not ' o I'm in trouble i'll join the union'.
Joining the union is a insurance policy...you may never need us but we are there when you do.
Use this NON UNION MEMBER as a example to others

[fishtank]

I also tell them if the s**t hits the fan then don't come running to the cwu, we don't back date problems

This isn't an issue of a member doing something silly and getting themselves into trouble then running to the union, this is an issue of management ignoring agreed procedures, most of these cases are, do we as a union turn a blind eye to management ignoring agreed procedures just because it's a non member affected?
That's a dangerous precedent to set.

Trade unions were primarily set up to protect the rights of the working man/woman, Membership was not a condition of that protection until the question of finance was introduced. Unfortunately with that membership came this cliqueish idea that only members of the club deserved protection, It is ironic that this elitist attitude thrives in an organisation designed to protect the working classes from the elitist establishment.

[pj2001]

I also tell them if the s**t hits the fan then don't come running to the cwu, we don't back date problems

This isn't an issue of a member doing something silly and getting themselves into trouble then running to the union, this is an issue of management ignoring agreed procedures, most of these cases are, do we as a union turn a blind eye to management ignoring agreed procedures just because it's a non member affected?
That's a dangerous precedent to set.

Trade unions were primarily set up to protect the rights of the working man/woman, Membership was not a condition of that protection until the question of finance was introduced. Unfortunately with that membership came this cliqueish idea that only members of the club deserved protection, It is ironic that this elitist attitude thrives in an organisation designed to protect the working classes from the elitist establishment.

So, let me get this straight, union members who pay their subs get no better treatment than non members!! If this is the case I can see the CWU is about to hemorrhage even more of its sub paying mugs err members.

[fishtank]

So, let me get this straight...

You need to try a bit harder.
There are trade unionists who are union members and there are simply union members, a trade unionist wishes to protect the working classes and would not stand by while management sh***s on a fellow worker and a simple union member wishes to protect him/herself with an insurance policy.

While I wouldn't necessarily criticise the simple union member it certainly isn't anywhere near the moral high ground, In a case like this where management are abusing procedures against a non-member it is in everybody's interest to stop it, By stopping it you send a clear message to management that these abuses will not be tolerated no matter who the target is, that an injury to one is indeed an injury to all and the next time you have to go to the gate you will find non members beside you.

I have some non members in my D.O. mostly for political reasons but not one has ever crossed a picket line because although they may not agree with unions they respect the fact that we all stand or fall together.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

I guess with some its income before ideals. Not sure if thats the sort of Union I signed up to.

Are we really saying that a Trade Union is only there to protect workers rights if they pay for it.

What about the counter argument that if the Union show by its actions why its worth joining, such as helping this poster out, won't that generate more interest in membership, and make the Union stronger in the long run.

One thing history has shown is that exclusion is regressive, inclusion is progressive.

Advertise the benefit of Union membership by taking action that benefits members, even if it means helping non-members. Leave this guy out to dry with no Union support and it will make any action to help a member in the same position that much more difficult, as the managers will think they have won and will dig their heels in.

Sometime we need to look at the bigger picture and no get so obsessed with the parochial view that only members should benefit from the actions of the Union. In my honest opinion this is why CWU membership is in decline in RM, people want to gain something from being a member and thats the wrong approach. I personally have gained nothing material from being a Union member, I have never needed them on a one to one basis, but I think the subs I have paid in are a good investment. You only have to project forward what it would be like post privatisation and what shape we would all be in if the Union didn't at least try to mitigate the worst excesses of Delivery Methods.

I won't paraphrase a certain ex-president of the USA, but thats my view on Union membership, anything else is far to market driven for me for an organisation that is there to defend workers, not just Union members.

[lmc]

I am only part time and have never booked a holiday yet,when does the holiday year run?

Hopefully I have built up a couple to take at some stage(only do 5 hours a week,started in March)

[janitor]

The leave year runs from April to march, so you should have full entitlement, not sure what that is for your hours, but am sure someone will be along to tell you, it should also state in your contract how many days holiday you are entitled to.

[korky]

should the o.p or anyone who works really have to resort to joining a union just to exercise their basic rights?
this isn't a case of fighting for something new or an improvement to terms, it's what's already set by law.
in our units case our union wouldn't achieve anything anyway,
it was proposed & agreed early last year that reserves would no longer have bank holidays thrust upon them for their day off that week.
yet it's still rife, and again, struggle to book the (near) extra 2 weeks holidays forced on them due to staffing problems caused by RM,
wouldn't surprise me if the buying of holidays will be scrapped soon

i guess its down to how approachable the manager is and how confident they are at insisting on using their entitlement.