Job & Done & Ghosting?

[clashcityrocker]

Think of it as money rather than hours if the conversation went pay me an extra £50 quid to clear that frame it's only going to take an hour and the dom agrees to it the clearly no deception or fraud as both partie were fully aware of what they are agreeing to

You seem a bit obsessed with the DOM and the postie.
Don't other people work in RM? Aren't other people affected by this complicit deception?

How many other national agreements are you happy to bypass for an individuals pecuniary gain?

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

Think of it as money rather than hours if the conversation went pay me an extra £50 quid to clear that frame it's only going to take an hour and the dom agrees to it the clearly no deception or fraud as both partie were fully aware of what they are agreeing to

You seem a bit obsessed with the DOM and the postie.
Don't other people work in RM? Aren't other people affected by this complicit deception?

How many other national agreements are you happy to bypass for an individuals pecuniary gain?

Where have I said anywhere I am happy with the practice going on? If you bothered to read my post I am simply saying the postie has not comitted fraud and not committed any deception

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

Ok, so we've established it's not fraud.

If I put my hand in your pocket and remove £50 is that theft? Isn't it the same if I take money from RM without actually earning it, or doesn't it count if you steal from a big corporate?

Again it's not theft as again both parties agreed to the amount before the work takes place that is the crux of the matter it's that agreement prior to the work that makes it completely legal for the postie

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

Where have I said anywhere I am happy with the practice going on? If you bothered to read my post I am simply saying the postie has not comitted fraud and not committed any deception

But it is deception, agreed, you're not deceiving your Lino or DOM cause you've agreed terms, but you ARE deceiving RM, I'm sure Senior Executives and Shareholders would not condone this practise and view it as deception.

The postie has not deceive rm in the slightest the dom has been delegated a budget to run his office, he has authority to spend that budget, if he is spending it in a fashion that the directors are not happy with then that's a matter between him and them but postie has not deceived anyone or committed fraud

[IcanthelpthewayIam]

Ok, I submit, I stand defeated, 'ghosting' is ok.

I'll just try to remember that when a postie does a double day, is paid until ten at night and at home by three, a regular occurrence in our DO.

I have at no point said it's ok, I am completely against it. I am simply pointing out that in some circumstances it's not fraud

[Patrick301]

at the end of the day some people like to drag the job out , keep customers waiting for mail and finish late often doing unpaid overtime at the end of thier duty
others like to just get on with it ,get the job done and get home
managers often dont bother them because ,these postmen provide an efficent service to the customers ,,keeping them happy
this pleases royal mail and thats what its all about

I notice you're MC/Processing Conman. Did you transfer there from Deliveries? If you didn't I wouldn't presume to judge Delivery Staff on their performance. And if you did then I'm sure you're well aware of the king of crap that goes on in most DOs on a Daily Recurring Basis.

i done a walk for 8 years ,,,,,,,,,, an hour or more at home for breakfast every morning ,,,,,,then back for a ten minute 2nd delivery in the car
and on saturdays back in the house for 9am
others dragged it out for extended ,,or were too slow , lazy or thick to complete on time
so they were paid more than me,,,,,,,,,sometimes it pays to be incompetent
although it did pay to get 3 hours a day for half a merge and still finish 1 and a half walks before your docket started

[IloveMYredTROLLEY!]

Devil's advocate moment: OPGs getting paid for more hours than they do on o/t should be helping the depot budget in our favour?

[dvbuk55]

Devil's advocate moment: OPGs getting paid for more hours than they do on o/t should be helping the depot budget in our favour?

If it did it would show a need for an increase in staff which hasn't happened but it does have an effect on lapsing which is on the increase and year round as opposed to the "light" summer months.

[fishtank]

The postie has not deceive rm in the slightest the dom has been delegated a budget to run his office, he has authority to spend that budget, if he is spending it in a fashion that the directors are not happy with then that's a matter between him and them but postie has not deceived anyone or committed fraud

Doms have rules they have to follow as well, I'm pretty sure that they do not have the authority to pay people for hours they haven't worked which means the Dom would have to be hiding it somehow.

I'm also pretty sure if the Dom got caught he/she would not throw their hands up and say it was all their fault but more likely throw the postie to the wolves. Things would get very messy and trusting your job security to an Employment Tribunal is risky and expensive.

Is it fraudulant booking of overtime?....of course it is, not illegal, possibly unlawful but certainly gross misconduct, who would take the rap? Dom or Postie? One or the other depending on who was the easiest to nail...or most likely to keep things tidy RM would just do both and let an ET sort out the mess.

Dumb as a box of rocks either way.

[justdeno]

A slight change to the subject. If (and I mean if) I claim OT, I have noticed a certain co worker always claims more OT then me even though they have gone before me. I know I do not pay him/her but I think this is fraud also. I am a SPDO and send the OT sheets in each morning. Does anyone else have this happen. They seem to think they are entitled to do this(DOM favourite).

[themailman]

A slight change to the subject. If (and I mean if) I claim OT, I have noticed a certain co worker always claims more OT then me even though they have gone before me. I know I do not pay him/her but I think this is fraud also. I am a SPDO and send the OT sheets in each morning. Does anyone else have this happen. They seem to think they are entitled to do this(DOM favourite).

I remember in the old green docket days, guys would look to see who was claiming what. The cry would be, 'Well if HES doing it, so am I'

[arnold cheshire]

A slight change to the subject. If (and I mean if) I claim OT, I have noticed a certain co worker always claims more OT then me even though they have gone before me. I know I do not pay him/her but I think this is fraud also. I am a SPDO and send the OT sheets in each morning. Does anyone else have this happen. They seem to think they are entitled to do this(DOM favourite).

I remember in the old green docket days, guys would look to see who was claiming what. The cry would be, 'Well if HES doing it, so am I'

green docket ? i remember a plain white sheet of a4 paper used has a docket

[themailman]

A slight change to the subject. If (and I mean if) I claim OT, I have noticed a certain co worker always claims more OT then me even though they have gone before me. I know I do not pay him/her but I think this is fraud also. I am a SPDO and send the OT sheets in each morning. Does anyone else have this happen. They seem to think they are entitled to do this(DOM favourite).

I remember in the old green docket days, guys would look to see who was claiming what. The cry would be, 'Well if HES doing it, so am I'

green docket ? i remember a plain white sheet of a4 paper used has a docket

white, with green lines maybe

[Spy]

FULLY UTILISE ALL PAID HOURS.
Agenda for growth, April 2014. (And recently updated I think)
I think some people are not doing their jobs properly.
I do not blame posties for running or for ghosting. Been there on both counts.
It would appear though that management are not doing what it says on the tin.
I would suggest contacting Ms Greene via just say it to air your views. I'm sure that she would be very interested.
Regarding posties who have been called "slow or lazy", then it is down to management to test these people. There are guidelines laid down and fully agreed with the CWU regarding sorting, prep and walking speeds.

[Mr_Pink]

Some of the problems are, (a)no real enhanced rate for overtime (b)DOMs wanting the office cleared at any cost. Solutions (a) would cost too much (b) would mean putting more staff in which RM don't want to do. So the status quo remains (for the time being) I'm sure we've all been asked to do O/T and had generous offers i.e. 8 hours to clear an already prepped walk because no one wants to do it, and in my opinion its so widespread that only a fool would believe that upper management aren't aware of such practices.