100% SOLD OUT AND TAKEN FOR A MUG. PLEASE READ AND REPLY!!!!

[kwikpost]

fact is dingo the union has ended the strikes without any agreement what so ever. all they've got is an agreement with r/m to contintue talking. now we all know what the management are like. the feeling where i work is the union will be shown the door as soon as xmas is over.

[fishtank]

"All London Area reps and Branch secretaries attended a meeting last Friday with Dave Ward for him to explain the agreement and answer questions. In addition the 4 London members of the postal executive were at the meeting."

Is this true dingo,if it is then divisions are already appearing.

Our area reps asked for permission to speak to members on friday and again on saturday and were refused.
Why are some in the loop and others being kept in the dark.
London would do well not to fall into Royal Mails trap of "appearing" to be the only benificiaries of this action.
A few more well chosen words may be a sensible course.

[smudger83]

At f***ing most we should have given em 2 weeks for talks, and if there was no progress have us out again

There is no commitment to not strike over Christmas and the ballot is still active. Stop falling for Brendan Barber's spiel. If RM f**k about then we can go again in 2 weeks.

Keep the strikes active while they talk! Why give the Royal Mail any breathing space!? They treat us like s**t and we had them by the balls! We had them playing to our rules! They were crumbling before our very eyes! FFS how hard is it to see were f**ked!? Are your eyes painted on!?

'Cos we get concessions from them for calling off the strikes in the short term. They now have to go through ACAS, which is something they weren't exactly keen on for obvious reasons. Meanwhile, we still have the option to restart the strikes if necessary. You've got to fight on the ground where you are strong. This all out attack people are advocating has historically ended in defeat.

The post below from another thread and is by a member called 'weetrogg' on here. It was such a good post I have just copied and pasted it.

For the I/A to be suspended and the "interim agreement" to be acceptable to me it needed to contain the following as a minimum

1) An immediate suspension of all unagreed lapsing/absorbing
2) An immediate standing down of these outhouses/scab units
3) An immediate independant review into bullying&harrassment
4) An immediate independant review into workrates and workloads
5) A public commitment by RM to go to acas to negotiate a binding national agreement

Now correct me if im wrong but the reasons above are why we were striking, yet having read the interim agreement non of this is guaranteed, so why call off the I/A?? Thank christ ive only took 2 days I/A an i still feel let down by HQ, if id took 15 or more days I/A like lots of others have id be f@+kig furious. Seriously if this goes the same way as 2007 the pec need to be removed en masse. Fool me once, shame on you,fool me twice shame on me!!

I think the above list would have justified a suspension of I/A but this "agreement" falls way short I would appreciate it if anybody can enlighten me of the plus points or concessions in this agreement

WE are the union


THE ABOVE IS THE ONLY CONCESSIONS I THINK ARE ACCEPTABLE Harry_Perkins

[dvbuk55]

"9 The TUC have brokered the deal with Government support and will also be involved if management breaks its terms.

10 The best wording we have seen on improving basic pay ,working hours , the future of deliveries and a resolution to the imposed network 2009."

9. Thats like putting the chicken in the hen house

10. The best wording - if only the thought was the deed.

As for the Londoners meetings this week ? What about the rest of us? London shouldn't forget that without the support nationally they wouldn't be sat at any table, and they would still be ignored by Royal Mail and going it alone.

[Martin Walsh]

On friday there was a conference call of all regional secretaires and divisional reps.

Tomorrow there is a meeting of the officers , pec , regional secretaries and divisonal reps at cwu hqs.

On Friday at the TUC there is a meeting of all branch"s a national briefing.

In the meantime I persume most divisionals will be meeting their regional directors to assess whether management are adhereing to the agreeement.

Now dont get me going about this is a London deal thats a load of rubbish. This is a deal for anyone who held the line and adhered to the unions policy of no savings it gets them back into local talks. In addition it provides for national talks on the future including the shorter working week.

We can have this debate again in a weeks time and decide on the facts if progress has been made or not.

[infidel]

well said fishtank LONDON agreement coming up,.

[fishtank]

"Now dont get me going about this is a London deal thats a load of rubbish. This is a deal for anyone who held the line and adhered to the unions policy of no savings it gets them back into local talks. In addition it provides for national talks on the future including the shorter working week."


"London would do well not to fall into Royal Mails trap of "appearing" to be the only benificiaries of this action.
A few more well chosen words may be a sensible course."

I don't think you read my post properly.
Or maybe it was not clear enough.
This agreement and any negotiatons must not only BE inclusive.
They have to be SEEN to be inclusive.
Not just at HQ regional,divisonal and area level but at MEMBERSHIP level.

[infidel]

what new ammo do you go into these local talks with,do tell ,lets see this new stuff were going in with[local].

[dvbuk55]

what new ammo do you go into these local talks with,do tell ,lets see this new stuff were going in with[local].

I think you have hit the nail on the head, what dingo is saying is "for those who held the union line and DIDN'T implement change" so presumably those of us who voted YES to strike action but have already suffered the EA, bullying and harassment can go and take a flying thingy - after all it is Sunday. If after two weeks there has been no change or new negotiations what do we do then? Report to HQ? Thats what went on before the strike, thats what caused the offices to ballot for action and it's taken the best part of six months for any action to be taken - so, there are 13 fortnights in six months................................

[Martin Walsh]

Fishtank of course local reps will be involved and any agreements reached at local level will have to be voted in by the members.

Now what ammo do we use well the fact that they know we have stood tall and fought for our future will be a good message. But think about what Royal Mail want longer spans , they want longer Saturdays , they want D2D into workload , they want walk sequencing , they want further efferincies. Well we to have an agenda and we want full time jobs , we want better pay , a shorter working week well thats why some offices will choose to go down the path of what 2.4 of the interim agreement allows and do the bigger deal and recieve the benefits immediately from the national talks on pay , benefits and hours.

But first and foremost we have to find out early whether Royal Mail are going to carry out the terms of this agreement , if they dont then we will be calling action within 2 weeks.

We will continue to fight for our futures. Now I know that our members will not give in and if management break the terms of this statement then the TUC and the independent party along with the Government will see that it is them not us who have sabotaged the agreement.

Keep the fiath and make sure we either get things moving forward in this week or I and many others will be calling for further action.

[dvbuk55]

Dingo, you keep saying OUR, somehow I don't think that is quite as inclusive as the rest of us think.

So we have the TUC, Government and as yet an undisclosed third party monitoring this joint statement and I am sure you are convinced that there will be scope for a return to industrial action after the two weeks are up if the terms of the statement aren't met - now is that a return to a National strike irrespective of where the failure occurs or is it going to be a local affair for the office/area/division affected. What terms would be considered a failure? Are offices already affected going to be able to re-negotiate changes and if not would that constitute a failure? You see I am not as convinced as you that RM, Brendan Barber and even Dave Ward are ready to concede that a return to industrial action is a possibility before Xmas, let alone after two weeks.

[BELIAL]

Got to admit ,soon as I read any mention of "local agreement" I see recipe for disaster. CWU is a national union and that is where it's only strength lies , or do we want to play the "this is just a London/Swindon/Burslem dispute" ? Fatal

[dvbuk55]

Got to admit ,soon as I read any mention of "local agreement" I see recipe for disaster. CWU is a national union and that is where it's only strength lies , or do we want to play the "this is just a London/Swindon/Burslem dispute" ? Fatal

I was a great critic of the 2007/2009 agreement and that proved to be prophetic and I wasn't the only one - I don't know if it is possible but I would just love to see if the same posters advocating this has been a success are the very same ones who thought that was a good deal too. I'll just bet they are and we all know why.

[Martin Walsh]

Hundreds of offices all across the UK have seen revisions imposed and will now be able to negotiate in order to reach agreement. All other offices which have implemented change in any part of the uk will now be able to undertake a review in line with the terms of this agreement.

In addition under the delivey words it re -states that all National agreements will stay in place and no imposed change will take place.

Dvbuk I would suggust that if management are unwilling to renegotate change in those areas where revisons are imposed or if the work does not return to its parent office or if we dont see the taking off pay process removed then we will be stating that the agreement is not working. I would suggust each divison will have this process in place remember there were over 500 offices taking strike action with another 120 who had applied for ballots before the cut off time for the national ballot.

Now I was with Dave on Friday he knows that unless Royal Mail adhere to the terms then the union will not have any option other then to call further strike action. The PEC carried that amendment unamiously on Thursday when accepting the agreement.

Nationally we want a solution not a strike and yes there will always be shouts of betrayal when a deal is reached and a strike is called off. But the facts are Royal Mail have two weeks to play ball if they dont them they know Christmas will be wrecked simple as that. Remember the ballots are still in place.

We hold the aces they dont. There is no NO Strike deal its a fact and whilst I hold no great hope that Royal Mail will honour what they agreed i do belive we have to test it rather than just lose members money on the premise that further strikes will see them cave in.

Remember the talks on the bigger picture will take at least 3 to 4 weeks if they meet 4 times per weeks and it becomes impossible to talk on the bigger stuff when we are taking strike action 2 or 3 days per week. As the negotiatiors start debating tit for tat stuff like the casuals or reps being done or letters which Royal Mail have sent out or adverts in the paper. Instead of disucssing the standards needed for offices or the simplfied pay package etc.

My opinion is that the words in this interim agreement are good enough but the acid test will be if Management at all levels carry out its terms. We wont have long to wait to tell.

[dvbuk55]

Dingo, every credit it to you for toeing the union line, for you this may be the answer to your prayers but I've been around a long time and in unions for nearly 40 years. I neither drink, smoke nor go with loose women so my brain isn't addled.

Still I have had time to consider this joint statement and if after 2 weeks we haven't been able to resolve anything, then I will be asking London to support our action because it hasn't suited us and I hope you will be as amenable as we have been.