Shorter working week

gb93 · Post by **gb93** » 27 Feb 2018, 08:54

Terrible deal for full timers.
Full timers have to do more work in less time for same pay.
Part timers have same time to do work & get more pay for it.
Full timers being shafted again to please the just in the door part timers.

polar bear · Post by **polar bear** » 27 Feb 2018, 12:51

When are we getting to vote on this?

Post by **97gaz** » 27 Feb 2018, 13:37

I_Take_My_Breaks · Post by **I_Take_My_Breaks** » 27 Feb 2018, 15:29

gb93 wrote:Terrible deal for full timers.
Full timers have to do more work in less time for same pay.
Part timers have same time to do work & get more pay for it.
Full timers being shafted again to please the just in the door part timers.

I totally agree with you on terrible deal for FT. I am voting NO.

But I do disagree with you on FT's have to do more work in less time for same pay. All you do is work at same pace and cut off 17 minutes worth of delivery (That's 12 minutes due to shorter working week and 5 minutes of arguing with Line Manager as to why) and go home right time or claim it on OT and treat it a pay rise.

number one · Post by **number one** » 27 Feb 2018, 17:10

gb93 wrote:Terrible deal for full timers.
Full timers have to do more work in less time for same pay.
Part timers have same time to do work & get more pay for it.
Full timers being shafted again to please the just in the door part timers.

Are you for real? It’s negative people like you thats the real problem. What deal would you have liked? How about they upped your working week to 45hrs but just paid you for 39? At least you could complete the work? You have a start time and finish time, you know that and managers know that. I am sick of negativity in the work place. This is the BEST deal they could secure and its a great deal. I bet you haven’t even read all the pages on the deal either. Go ahead vote no and if it is a yes result I hope you refuse the pay rise.

clashcityrocker · Post by **clashcityrocker** » 27 Feb 2018, 17:29

number one wrote: This is the BEST deal they could secure and its a great deal. I bet you haven’t even read all the pages on the deal either. Go ahead vote no and if it is a yes result I hope you refuse the pay rise.

I agree this is the best deal they could secure.
How is it a great deal?
I have read all the pages of the agreement. I was appalled.
How could one possibly refuse the pay rise? Stop ranting like a small child.

number one · Post by **number one** » 27 Feb 2018, 17:39

clashcityrocker wrote:
number one wrote: This is the BEST deal they could secure and its a great deal. I bet you haven’t even read all the pages on the deal either. Go ahead vote no and if it is a yes result I hope you refuse the pay rise.
I agree this is the best deal they could secure.
How is it a great deal?
I have read all the pages of the agreement. I was appalled.
How could one possibly refuse the pay rise? Stop ranting like a small child.

It’s a great deal because there is no “catch”!

5% payrise backdated
2% pay rise next year
Improved working conditions
Improved pension
Still kept hold of sick pay/allowances
Shorter working week
An extension to legal binding agreements

Whats not great about it? All the negative normans thats just can’t see a positive in anything the CWU do for them.

k979aaa · Post by **k979aaa** » 27 Feb 2018, 18:03

number one wrote:
clashcityrocker wrote:
number one wrote: This is the BEST deal they could secure and its a great deal. I bet you haven’t even read all the pages on the deal either. Go ahead vote no and if it is a yes result I hope you refuse the pay rise.
I agree this is the best deal they could secure.
How is it a great deal?
I have read all the pages of the agreement. I was appalled.
How could one possibly refuse the pay rise? Stop ranting like a small child.
It’s a great deal because there is no “catch”!

5% payrise backdated
2% pay rise next year
Improved working conditions
Improved pension
Still kept hold of sick pay/allowances
Shorter working week
An extension to legal binding agreements

Whats not great about it? All the negative normans thats just can’t see a positive in anything the CWU do for them.

It's not just about the CWU we are the CWU the reps those that got the vote did so by engaging the membership and we tell our reps what we want we cannot always get what we want in the first instant this process has taken nearly two years and getting the right deal right is the least we can accept for this is a deal that will change not just our pay but the way we all work! But too get this deal right is of the most upmost importance things need to be answered and in a correct way by no means is this a bad agreement but is it the right agreement for the future only you all can decide that and for that you need the answers to the questions that have been raised by all on this forum which also demands a commendation for it's right too speak for our rights and let us do it so!

DGH · Post by **DGH** » 27 Feb 2018, 18:42

number one wrote: This is the BEST deal they could secure and its a great deal.

Is your real name D. Trump by any chance?

number one · Post by **number one** » 27 Feb 2018, 19:02

DGH wrote:
number one wrote: This is the BEST deal they could secure and its a great deal.
Is your real name D. Trump by any chance?

Ok, give us facts. What other deal do you think we could have got? Lets see if your argument has any backing or are you just another knowit all that knows nothing?

gb93 · Post by **gb93** » 27 Feb 2018, 19:34

number one wrote:
gb93 wrote:Terrible deal for full timers.
Full timers have to do more work in less time for same pay.
Part timers have same time to do work & get more pay for it.
Full timers being shafted again to please the just in the door part timers.

Are you for real? It’s negative people like you thats the real problem. What deal would you have liked? How about they upped your working week to 45hrs but just paid you for 39? At least you could complete the work? You have a start time and finish time, you know that and managers know that. I am sick of negativity in the work place. This is the BEST deal they could secure and its a great deal. I bet you haven’t even read all the pages on the deal either. Go ahead vote no and if it is a yes result I hope you refuse the pay rise.

Easy Moya
Take a look at my previous posts & you might detect some sarcasm in the post

Post by **POSTMAN** » 27 Feb 2018, 22:13

Regarding just absorbing the work, if you have a look at the VIDEO : LONDON DIVISIONAL BRIEFING - Reaction and taking your questions there is a bloke (Tony Bouch NEC) about 3 mins in who says that the IWT along with PDA outdoor actuals will be used and if it warrants, there will be investment in the DO (Which I presume he means extra hr's) if needed.

POSTMAN EDIT : Topic moved to 'Royal Mail's proposals : CWU Four Pillars of Security Campaign' forum.This is to keep everything regarding the agreement in one place.
Please be careful where you start a topic, please make sure it is in the correct forum for those looking in especially newbies who are logging on/registering for the latest info.

steve1873 · Post by **steve1873** » 27 Feb 2018, 22:35

chickenwittle wrote:
ted_e_bear wrote:Has anyone got any idea if/how they're actually going to take an hours work off,ok it's easy to say we'll start 12mins later but still doing the same amount of work ! I understand how more automation will reduce indoor work but presumably that won't happen the day we start our 38hr week.
I reckon our Dom will just say the usual answer to everything 'you'll be ok the mail's down'
Correct , start 12 mins later and do same amount of work .

Or do 12 mins less work!

clashcityrocker · Post by **clashcityrocker** » 28 Feb 2018, 10:30

number one wrote:
It’s a great deal because there is no “catch”!

5% payrise backdated
2% pay rise next year
Improved working conditions
Improved pension
Still kept hold of sick pay/allowances
Shorter working week
An extension to legal binding agreements

Whats not great about it? All the negative normans thats just can’t see a positive in anything the CWU do for them.

Firstly 7% over 3 years is a below inflation wage rise - meaning a cut in your standard of living.
It may be the best we could hope for in the current economic climate and it may be a good deal when compared to others but it it still a cut in our standard of living and as such cannot be hailed as a great deal.
The 2% in 2019 may prove to be a total disaster for many of us.

What improved working conditions? Increased productivity?
How will we be measuring efficiency?

Improved pension? What the one that doesn't yet exist? With an NRA of 67? The one with "targets" and no guarantees?
It certainly is not an improvement on the DB scheme I was in.

Sick pay?
7. Both parties agree to undertake a joint review to improve the management of sick absence and improve overall attendance levels.

How do you improve overall attendance levels if people are genuinely sick?

This review will build on the joint work already completed on attendance last year ....

What joint work was that?

SWW.
12. A reduction in the working week of one hour from Oct 2018 subject to:
A) Delivery of trials and an implementation plan informed by the outcomes of those trials for both Delivery methods and Resource scheduler (including hours capture)

What trials exactly? What effect will they have on our working practices and start times?
We have already had intimations from the company that the 1 hour reduction will be "absorbed" no matter what the NEC say or the words of the agreement state.

An extension of the legally binding agreements?
The only evidence most of us have ever seen of these legally binding agreements is when RM took the CWU to the High Court (and the cleaners) to enforce the mediation and stop the strike action.

I don't mind someone saying this is the best we could achieve in the circumstances.
I don't even mind it being described as a reasonable agreement.
It isn't great and we are not on the cusp of something special.
No catch? There are more catches in there than in the seas off Shetland.