How to get lots of free hours!!

Post by **SpacePhoenix** » 14 Apr 2017, 23:53

bustedflush wrote: kick-off to managers about lapsing because it's Wednesday and that means they will start their docket 1 hour before finishing time rather than the usual 1.5 hours.

I wonder how many "runners" actually realise that they're the one giving managers more scope for both lapsing and delivery points added to walks

BeamishStout · Post by **BeamishStout** » 15 Apr 2017, 13:29

bustedflush wrote:
I wouldn't say it's 'divided' as such, more like the fact there are 2 kinds of posties.

1. RUNNER

2. WORK TO TIMER:

And probably the vast majority lie somewhere between.

tommyrep · Post by **tommyrep** » 15 Apr 2017, 14:45

Runners/work to timers.
The whole concept of those titles to describe posties has only arisen since job n knock was removed from the normal postie routine a few years back. It is truly incredible how the pendulum has swung in favour of RM management. RM have taken up the challenge to get as much work/time out of an OPG as possible then EVEN more.
I really do not have a problem with any young fleet of foot postie being able to run around the streets delivering mail - the down side of mistakes and other often overlooked mis-demeanours by managers etc as a given, - the real problem in delivery is, managers use that against the "work to timers"
The pressure on others who do not or are less able to make time on delivery is WRONG. Managers DO regardless of what they may claim compare every postie in the same category as the ones who start early, miss breaks and physically run to cover a duty in xyz time. The blinkered managers unfairly, and everyone in delivery has heard the oft said phrase " everyone else can complete on time", compare the "work to timers" with "runners". The runners, younger lads, by their actions put pressure onto other people who's only fault is doing the job properly, as RM would have you believe and like to promote. Utter bull..t and we ALL know that.
My views are even further compounded by other colleagues pointing the finger and by this action allowing the unscrupulous management to exert/impose even more unfair pressure on those unable OR unprepared to run, start early, miss breaks, rush around on delivery ONLY to have EVEN more work piled on. It's madness that I cannot comprehend.
Does nobody else notice this basic divide and rule policy is at work and is now the norm at every DO in the country ?
As I have said, who could have seen or believed a pendulum could swing so far, we have taken the carrot dangled and management are laughing their ba..s off as to how easy the workforce have made their job to put the boot in and open the door even further for more bullying, harassment and intimidation with no fear of accountability created by a divided selfish workforce that WERE once proud colleagues who stuck together. I am ashamed to be associated with many fellow posties.

gb93 · Post by **gb93** » 15 Apr 2017, 18:45

I'm reading some good posts today

Northblue82 · Post by **Northblue82** » 15 Apr 2017, 20:18

Bahia Feliz wrote:
daveyeff wrote:
Northblue82 wrote:Some of the experienced posties in our office refuse to take out their lapsing as they would go over when in fact the same posties are the first to finish each day at around 1pm and then come back for OT on collection.
that'll be right.
More experienced posties stand up for themselves more,If you don't like it do something about it instead of whining on here!

It's not standing up for themselves, it's crapping on their "work mates" who then have to cover the lapsing while they sit at home having a break before returning for OT.

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 15 Apr 2017, 20:50

Northblue82 wrote:
Bahia Feliz wrote:
daveyeff wrote:
Northblue82 wrote:Some of the experienced posties in our office refuse to take out their lapsing as they would go over when in fact the same posties are the first to finish each day at around 1pm and then come back for OT on collection.
that'll be right.
More experienced posties stand up for themselves more,If you don't like it do something about it instead of whining on here!
It's not standing up for themselves, it's crapping on their "work mates" who then have to cover the lapsing while they sit at home having a break before returning for OT.

They are entitled to a 40 minute break.

Only people who have time within their duty have to Lapse.

Anything else is not workmates crapping on each other, its poor management.

If people continue to label other workers with pejorative statements on both sides of the argument then they are only encouraging the B&H culture we all profess to hate.

Professor Chaos · Post by **Professor Chaos** » 15 Apr 2017, 21:01

bustedflush wrote:Work hard and reap the rewards. Docket is generally done on a piece-work rate. A necessary evil for the DO to meet delivery obligations. Ghost OT is the happy medium reached over the years, a bit of worker capitalism. If a reserve, who would you want to be paired with - the runner who will drop you back an hour early before they do their docket, or the office snail who can turn dropping letters into 8 lobby boxes in a block of flats into a major ordeal?

There is NO ghosting in my office and EVERYONE is made to stay to their time or do extra work if they return early. Also we hardly ever lapse.

Post by **eastie** » 15 Apr 2017, 21:27

I couldnt care less about what is happening with my co workers,if someone wants to run round like a lunatic and finish early its up to them, what time they are finishing, whether they jump fences or run or doorstep packets why worry. If they f*ck up or missdeliver its down to the DOM to sort out.
Only interested in no 1 , I'm not slow but I do the job properly.
If I'm with a runner I don't speed up for his benefit
There are posties who know who is doing which round, who is doing docket on what round.
Don't give in to pressure from the DOM either.
Seen too many runners who have had hip replacements and knee and back problems
just do my own round and if I want to go over I will and if I want to cut off I will then go home.

clashcityrocker · Post by **clashcityrocker** » 16 Apr 2017, 08:33

TrueBlueTerrier wrote: Anything else is not workmates crapping on each other, its poor management.

Or is it a bit of both?

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 16 Apr 2017, 09:19

clashcityrocker wrote:
TrueBlueTerrier wrote: Anything else is not workmates crapping on each other, its poor management.
Or is it a bit of both?

In my honest opinion. NO

It's crap management that allows people to do J&F.
It's crap management to bully people into working over.
It's crap management when lapsing isn't fairly distributed.
It's crap management when the cutting off procedure isn't followed.
It's crap management that allows Ghost overtime for an extra row, but not on your own duty.
It's crap management when they arbitrarily enforce breaks on one person, or a few.
It's crap management when they try to make their job easier, not yours.

Do colleagues take the piss, of course, they do, but again its crap management that allows them to.

number one · Post by **number one** » 16 Apr 2017, 10:33

I am sure the people who do job and finish don't think its crap management. It's the old saying, you can't please all the people all the time.

postslippete · Post by **postslippete** » 16 Apr 2017, 10:42

I suspect that staff would not condemn the idea of 'ghost' overtime so much if it didn't affect them in a negative way. But all the business sees are some staff finishing early and thinks that the only way of keeping everyone working to their time is to give everybody lapsing. Maybe it has been a management failing for years but what if the business thought a different way?

I used to work in a factory many moons ago that operated on a 'time and motion' basis. That means that we got paid on the basis of how much work that we did. So those guys that like to drag it out, well fine, you drag it out but you are only going to get paid by how many loops that you do. Regardless of whether you are old or young. You do exactly what you are capable of doing.

Now what system could be more fairer than that?

number one · Post by **number one** » 16 Apr 2017, 10:52

It will bever be fair. What if your loop was bigger than mine? I can do two loops to your one? Not because I am fast just because my loop was smaller? Terrece house delivery vs detached house delivery, only one winner there.

postslippete · Post by **postslippete** » 16 Apr 2017, 11:15

Yes, its different on different days depending on mail traffic/packet volumes etc etc But its never realistically taken me 20 minutes to do a loop. Its on average at least 35 to 45 minutes depending on various factors, so maybe the duties in the office need reassessing??

We have got some real small frames for staff that do the rural areas/farms and they only perhaps do 20-25 calls (on light days they are probably only doing 10 calls per loop), whereas the bigger town duties will do at least 100 calls per loop.

clashcityrocker · Post by **clashcityrocker** » 16 Apr 2017, 11:22

TrueBlueTerrier wrote:
Do colleagues take the piss, of course, they do, but again its crap management that allows them to.

But given that there are no real performance standards in RM, how exactly does a manger ensure someone isn't taking the piss.
Depending on how big your office is, it may be difficult for a manger to ensure everyone turns up on the IPS on time and stays there until they should leave.
Why exactly would you need a manager to ensure someone does their fair share unless you are working with children?
I don't want (or personally need) this constant management supervision. I want my colleagues to act like grown ups in a working environment and not like children in a kindergarten.
Despite the constant demand on these pages for a reduction in management numbers you appear to be arguing for finding them more work.
We need managers to ensure we do our job properly?

And people not doing their fair share ultimately makes the unit less efficient and a demand for an increase in efficiency leads to what?