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Is seniority illegal

Postal workers discussion forum. Discuss the day to day life in a Blue Shirt.
tinkerdil
MAIL CENTRES/PROCESSING
Posts: 81
Joined: 17 Oct 2011, 18:16
Gender: Male

Re: Is seniority illegal

Post by tinkerdil »

Seniority isn't perfect but I dread to think of the workplace without it.
Acca Dacca
Posts: 3226
Joined: 16 Aug 2009, 17:13
Gender: Male

Re: Is seniority illegal

Post by Acca Dacca »

SpacePhoenix wrote: ↑
11 Dec 2020, 07:02
Long term I can see there being an end to fixed walks. If letters and flats eventually get reduced in the number of days they're delivered and RM get barcodes on every parcel (something every other courier has done for years) then with the right software they could have walks dynamically generated each day
As has been pointed it - management struggle enough organising things with FIXED walks

Imagine the time wasted trying to organise different and ever changing walks every day?

I dont think it would work
If you tolerate this, then your paid break will be next
Woody Guthrie
Posts: 5166
Joined: 29 Sep 2018, 20:47
Gender: Male

Re: Is seniority illegal

Post by Woody Guthrie »

SpacePhoenix wrote: ↑
11 Dec 2020, 07:02
Long term I can see there being an end to fixed walks. If letters and flats eventually get reduced in the number of days they're delivered and RM get barcodes on every parcel (something every other courier has done for years) then with the right software they could have walks dynamically generated each day
Who's going to randomly generate these walks?
Bearing in mind the walks have to be sequenced at what stage are they generated?
How would this be communicated down to DO level?

To have that level change each day would have to make sense from a savings point of view and that would only be the case if there were massive fluctuations on a daily basis which is unlikely.

Efficiency comes from system structure, the more you interfere unnecessarily with the basic structure the more inefficiencies you introduce into the system.

What’s more likely is some kind of adaptation to the existing lapsing system where you have a core duty and the lapsing fluctuates on a daily basis.
Only dead fish follow the current
Celgar
Posts: 2795
Joined: 01 Nov 2017, 17:11
Gender: Male

Re: Is seniority illegal

Post by Celgar »

Woody Guthrie wrote: ↑
11 Dec 2020, 22:51
SpacePhoenix wrote: ↑
11 Dec 2020, 07:02
Long term I can see there being an end to fixed walks. If letters and flats eventually get reduced in the number of days they're delivered and RM get barcodes on every parcel (something every other courier has done for years) then with the right software they could have walks dynamically generated each day
Who's going to randomly generate these walks?
Bearing in mind the walks have to be sequenced at what stage are they generated?
How would this be communicated down to DO level?

To have that level change each day would have to make sense from a savings point of view and that would only be the case if there were massive fluctuations on a daily basis which is unlikely.

Efficiency comes from system structure, the more you interfere unnecessarily with the basic structure the more inefficiencies you introduce into the system.

What’s more likely is some kind of adaptation to the existing lapsing system where you have a core duty and the lapsing fluctuates on a daily basis.
Ofcom have said RM need to make more savings in addition to dropping Saturdays and DSA changes such as not delivering only one letter or item of DSA. I think they will look to automation of parcel & packet sorting as their next move rather micromanagement of DO duty rotas. I wouldn't be surprised to see seasonal duty rota changes in the future though as a cost saving device. Given the pace of change from high street to online shopping RM are going to struggle to cut staff in DO and continue to be able to get the mail delivered as well. Eventually there is a point where no more savings can be made.
The views I express here are mine alone and do not represent the views of Royal Mail Group.
k979aaa
Posts: 12578
Joined: 03 Sep 2007, 19:14
Gender: Male
Location: THE NORTH

Re: Is seniority illegal

Post by k979aaa »

Celgar wrote: ↑
11 Dec 2020, 23:46
Woody Guthrie wrote: ↑
11 Dec 2020, 22:51
SpacePhoenix wrote: ↑
11 Dec 2020, 07:02
Long term I can see there being an end to fixed walks. If letters and flats eventually get reduced in the number of days they're delivered and RM get barcodes on every parcel (something every other courier has done for years) then with the right software they could have walks dynamically generated each day
Who's going to randomly generate these walks?
Bearing in mind the walks have to be sequenced at what stage are they generated?
How would this be communicated down to DO level?

To have that level change each day would have to make sense from a savings point of view and that would only be the case if there were massive fluctuations on a daily basis which is unlikely.

Efficiency comes from system structure, the more you interfere unnecessarily with the basic structure the more inefficiencies you introduce into the system.

What’s more likely is some kind of adaptation to the existing lapsing system where you have a core duty and the lapsing fluctuates on a daily basis.
Ofcom have said RM need to make more savings in addition to dropping Saturdays and DSA changes such as not delivering only one letter or item of DSA. I think they will look to automation of parcel & packet sorting as their next move rather micromanagement of DO duty rotas. I wouldn't be surprised to see seasonal duty rota changes in the future though as a cost saving device. Given the pace of change from high street to online shopping RM are going to struggle to cut staff in DO and continue to be able to get the mail delivered as well. Eventually there is a point where no more savings can be made.
Flexibility will be the key 7 day deliveries mostly packets and priority items like tracked 24 and specials will be a 7 day 18 hour delivery span.
Thing is we will become more and more like Amazon in terms and conditions hours working practices (pissing in bottles for lack of basic humanities) We can make a stand against this but time has passed our union leaders as they don't have a scobby doo what to do anymore!
Celgar
Posts: 2795
Joined: 01 Nov 2017, 17:11
Gender: Male

Re: Is seniority illegal

Post by Celgar »

The idea of delivering parcels for four hours on Sunday (Today!!) was 'put out there' by our DOM a couple of days ago as a message from the bosses higher up. Even the postie in our DO who grabs all the overtime he can find said a definite NO! The DOM couldn't clarify what we would be paid for doing it either & the last time we worked on a Sunday at Xmas we didn't get paid properly.
We are all doing our best but these are unprecedented times with a shift to working at home and shopping online. These changes were going to happen anyway and its likely we return to the old ways now. Systems like HS2 are out of date before even a single piece of track has been laid. The public will just have to be patient and in 2021 strongly consider doing Xmas shopping in October or even in September.

PS oops I think I have taken this OP off topic. Sorry.
The views I express here are mine alone and do not represent the views of Royal Mail Group.
k979aaa
Posts: 12578
Joined: 03 Sep 2007, 19:14
Gender: Male
Location: THE NORTH

Re: Is seniority illegal

Post by k979aaa »

I used to work Christmas Sundays when the pay was good would just laugh in their face if they asked me now.