our REPS changed his tune !!

[fishtank]

Postie A preps 1400 items on his walk but no D2D.
Postie B preps 1400 items including 300 D2D items.
Same work but different pay. You think that is fair? I don't.
My guess is there will be more people better off with the new supplement than without it (they just don't post on RMC).

There are some CCR,the problem is they don't deliver D2D.
And before you say it's a delivery supplement not a D2D supplement you have to understand,
The bulk of the money to pay for this supplement was captured from the D2D payments.
Payments people were relying on to pay their bills.
It is then absolutely ridiculous to expect those same delivery staff that were penalised with a pay cut to then carry the burden of extra workload through an absolutely shambolic uncapped d2d into workload system that will be completely unworkable and unmanagable.
How much time to prep 3 at 500 calls
How much time to prep 3 at 500 calls with double slots.
How much time to prep 3 at 500 calls is 2 have pens and wont fit in the slots.
How much time to prep 3 at 500 calls if you only get 2 on the monday and 1 on the wednesday.
How much time to prep 4 at 500 calls
How much time to prep 4 at 500 calls with double slots.
How much time to prep 4 at 500 calls is 2 have pens and wont fit in the slots.
How much time to prep 4 at 500 calls if you only get 2 on the monday and 1 on the wednesday
Then there's 600 calls etc,5,6,7 D2D,rural duties,duties with business and residential mix.
What happens if someone is sick and a reserve is thrown on at the last minute?
None of the above will be taken into account it will be a one size fits all compromise.
How do i know that,because it always is and don't talk to me about new relationships ,i've heard it all before.
Offices will need a dedicated D2D manager AND rep just to deal with this on a WEEKLY and sometimes DAILY basis.
It WILL end in B&H and people taking it home or coming in early to do it.
And don't get me started on Early Shift Allowance.

[belle smith]

I must admit after attending our AGM, it was Bob Gibson that swayed me to change my mind to a 60/40 yes vote, I was a total no vote. It does look as though most of us who have changed their minds, have had Bob Gibson speaking to them somewhere in the mix.

As I said after my AGM, it really is worth trying to get to your AGM, especially if someone from headquarters is going to be there, but particularly if Bob Gibson is there, I'm not suggesting that anyone will change their mind, but it will allow you to ask questions to one of the negotiators.

Don't get me wrong, I still think it's a crap deal, but I don't really see where else we can go, I know we don't have the fight to go out on the streets in our office, we had problems getting them out last time. I've already had a number of people asking when they get their 400 quid, and once RM start sending out their letters and WTL sessions, I only expect more in this vain, a bit pathetic really, but there you go.

I appreciate your honesty trythat. still 100% no from me and i really don't see a meeting with Bob Gibson changing my mind.

[welshy808]

I must admit after attending our AGM, it was Bob Gibson that swayed me to change my mind to a 60/40 yes vote, I was a total no vote. It does look as though most of us who have changed their minds, have had Bob Gibson speaking to them somewhere in the mix.

As I said after my AGM, it really is worth trying to get to your AGM, especially if someone from headquarters is going to be there, but particularly if Bob Gibson is there, I'm not suggesting that anyone will change their mind, but it will allow you to ask questions to one of the negotiators.

Don't get me wrong, I still think it's a crap deal, but I don't really see where else we can go, I know we don't have the fight to go out on the streets in our office, we had problems getting them out last time. I've already had a number of people asking when they get their 400 quid, and once RM start sending out their letters and WTL sessions, I only expect more in this vain, a bit pathetic really, but there you go.

Why have we got to go back on strike?
Why not get Bob Gibson to go back to Royal Mail and do what we pay him to do, negotiate a better deal?
Both Bob Gibson and Dave Ward are travelling the country selling this agreement with the idea that if it's a No then it will only get worse. Well even offices that have had EA imposed are not getting it as bad as this agreement allows, they do not work till 3 on a Saturday, they have not had the cap on D2D removed and they have not had the payment for D2D stopped. Why? Because without your permission through a yes vote Royal mail cannot change your terms of contract. they could give every single person redundancy then re-employ you on a new contract, but would they I doubt it very much.

One Question you should have asked Bob Gibson
"when I return from my delivery on a Saturday at 3pm after a full drop of D2D's and a 60 year old delivery officer has been suspended for being unable to keep up with the top 10% will he be available at HQ to give you advice?"

[clashcityrocker]

Was that a yes?????
and we currently do 17.5 of those delivering we will do more than this under this agreement, if your saying that the ips or prep is just the same as delivering then your having a laugh!!! and i think we will just have to agree to disagree.

It wasn't a yes. Obviously delivery is physically more strenuous than IPS. But mentally I think most posties are happier out on delivery.
I currently do 20 hrs/week out on delivery.( I'm looking forward to doing them without a bag over my shoulder.)
But that was a choice we had to make. If the indoor work isn't there what do you do?

[belle smith]

Was that a yes?????
and we currently do 17.5 of those delivering we will do more than this under this agreement, if your saying that the ips or prep is just the same as delivering then your having a laugh!!! and i think we will just have to agree to disagree.

It wasn't a yes. Obviously delivery is physically more strenuous than IPS. But mentally I think most posties are happier out on delivery.
I currently do 20 hrs/week out on delivery.( I'm looking forward to doing them without a bag over my shoulder.)
But that was a choice we had to make. If the indoor work isn't there what do you do?

I misunderstood you then. we've plenty of indoor work even with getting sequenced trays in.

[clashcityrocker]

Offices will need a dedicated D2D manager

Does that mean it will be creating a new job in every DO?

[fishtank]

Offices will need a dedicated D2D manager

Does that mean it will be creating a new job in every DO?

Thinking of applying?

[clashcityrocker]

Offices will need a dedicated D2D manager

Does that mean it will be creating a new job in every DO?

Thinking of applying?

Anything to keep me off the 7hr delivery with 12 D2D (2 with pens in) that everyone will be getting every week. (Mass hysteria emoticon please)
Are you doing the interviews?

[fishtank]

Are you doing the interviews?

Yes these are the details
"COMPETITIVE SALARY"
We remain competitive by paying less than our competitors.

"JOIN OUR FAST-PACED TEAM"
We have no time to train you.

"MUST BE DEADLINE ORIENTED"
You'll be six months behind schedule on your first day.

"SOME OVERTIME REQUIRED"
Some time each night and some time each weekend.

"DUTIES WILL VARY"
Anyone in the office can boss you around.

"MUST HAVE AN EYE FOR DETAIL"
We have no quality control.

"APPLY IN PERSON"
If you're old, fat or ugly you'll be told the position has been filled.

"SEEKING CANDIDATES WITH A WIDE VARIETY OF EXPERIENCE"
You'll need it to replace three people who just left.

"PROBLEM-SOLVING SKILLS A MUST"
You're walking into a company in perpetual chaos.

"REQUIRES TEAM LEADERSHIP SKILLS"
You'll have the responsibilities of a manager, without the pay.

"GOOD COMMUNICATION SKILLS"
Management communicates, you listen, figure out what they want and do it.

Still fancy the job?

[clashcityrocker]

Still fancy the job?

Being old, fat and ugly I don't think it is worth my while forwarding my CV to you.

[dvbuk55]

I done exactly the same after attending the glasgow meeting, lets put a few facts in the face of your argument, 1) d2d is not a guranteed payment, it could end next year and probably will if a no vote is returned, 2) if they put six in one envelope as they trialled in swindon, your d2d payments drop alarmingly, 3) d2d is now put into your workload, thus protecting our jobs,4) the £20.62 payment is paid 52 weeks a year, not just when you do d2d's, just part of the reason I changed my view, and where do we go if there's a no vote, whats plan b, I would like to know what more you think you can get out of royal mail in this economic climate?

And your part time members will be exactly how much better off?

You know the old saying if it sounds too good to be true - it usually is and the snake oil salesmen have done a wonderful job -

D2D is not a guaranteed payment - no it isn't but it has been consistent, and if the arse was going to fall out of the market would RM want this deal? The answer of course is no - they want this deal because the market IS there but they dont want to pay.

D2D has always been in the workload albeit in name and without any increase, how are jobs to be protected? Particularly when the delivery span is unspecified.

Why do you need a Plan B - plan A is bad enough, but seriously if there is no agreement then you go back to the status quo and when Royal Mail try to implement change then the CWU fight your corner WHICH IS WHAT WE PAY THEM FOR, not to become another tier of Royal Mail Management.

These people can talk, they are where they are because they CAN talk, they will say whatever they like to persuade people to change their opinion, such as - most people will be completed on Saturdays by 1430 - it may sound plausible, BUT it is NOT in the agreement 1500 and 1600 ARE, so when you complain to management that you aren't finishing by 1430, they will say so what, you'll say Bob Gibson said in Glasgow most people will be completed by 1430 and they'll say Who the f*ck is Bob Gibson.

[patio1]

a rep from different office came to collect today and he has changed his tune seriously. on friday the deal was the worst thing ever. TODAY THE SLICE BREAD HAS CAME OUT!!!!!!
started whittling on to me about how are jobs are gonna be safe and because he has just found out that the mail centre he works for maybe shutting he will effectively be without a job.

i have never known anyone change there tune so much.

i hope he gets put on delivery cos he last done delivery 15 years ago . he is gonna struggle big time then he will wished we would have never voted this in. (IF IT GETS VOTED IN).

he was giving it biggun and i can,t wait till he has 10 bags p...ing down with rain. freezin cold working like a donkey till half 2/3 on a saturday. gets in and kids and wife wanna go out and play. he will be like the rest of us too knackered to do anything. EXCEPT CRAWL UP THOSE STAIRS AND HIT THE SACK .

OH WHAT A LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mazza111]

Got the meeting tomorrow, but refuse to go in early for it. They asked, I refused

But going by the rep's attitude it looks like they are looking for a yes vote. Manager said he will talk me through "the meeting" on a one 2 one. Probably at the same time as giving me my stage 1 for being off 4 times in the year Albeit a total of 6 days, just wish I had taken 4 weeks off now :D

[Big Daz]

What agreement and who is it with? I thought it was just a internal RM policy? No reason why it can be applied to certain types of leaflets?

So long as the customer is aware of the system being used by RML before they place their request for leaflet delivery, then no harm done. If we loose customers as a result , then RML would switch back wouldnt they?

are you saying we don't have an agreement to be paid for delivering d2d? why do RM pay us for them just now then.....generocity of spirit?

I was refering to automating and having X amount in one envelope which RM would class as one item. As soon as automating looks set to go go nationwide as the norm, then current pence per item system (if we were to keep it) would I say be in urgent need of beeing looked at to reflect the the reality of DTD in the 2nd decade of the 21st century. A new system would need a new agreement? You appear to suggest that DTD in one envelope is in breach of a agreement.


laudrup11 wrote:
I would ask for your reaction if RM start automating the D2D (admittedly its a big if) as they are trialling in Swindon right now and you started getting 5 or 6 inside one envelope and paid 1.67p each?

belle smith wrote:

I'd be astonished, as you say your self thats a big if, for one thing customer don't want them deliverd like that, and i'd imagine that they would be in breach of the existing agreement.

[belle smith]

The answer of course is no - they want this deal because the market IS there but they dont want to pay.

They usually get excited by how much it's growing.