Non drivers

[Sean06]

Everybody out. !

WHY

[postmanplod69]

As a non driver who has never had a licence,I've enjoyed reading all the different points of view, some people really don't like non drivers do they and the thought of them possibly doing Monday to Friday has them really really annoyed.
Martin Walsh said "the union are against this because they don't want a two tier workforce" but I personally think Royal mail will push for it saves them a headache deciding what they do with them on a Saturday.

[Barnacle]

As a non driver who has never had a licence,I've enjoyed reading all the different points of view, some people really don't like non drivers do they and the thought of them possibly doing Monday to Friday has them really really annoyed.
Martin Walsh said "the union are against this because they don't want a two tier workforce" but I personally think Royal mail will push for it saves them a headache deciding what they do with them on a Saturday.

Yes it does seem that some are bitter and twisted about non-drivers possibly having the weekend off however..
In the pilot sites it has been found that it is not possible for a human to do five days on the trot of such a high call rate. Who knew?
Fatigue is the new knackered.

So like it or not, RM have to create shifts for non-drivers on a Saturday. This is not too difficult really but the current management are averse to being creative.

[Acca Dacca]

How do we know that having Sat and Sun off together dont help with the fatigue if its not been trialled for a good period of time?

As far as I know no non driver has been given that option to trial in any of the pilots

[Barnacle]

How do we know that having Sat and Sun off together dont help with the fatigue if its not been trialled for a good period of time?

As far as I know no non driver has been given that option to trial in any of the pilots

The problem then is when the person doing five days on the trot goes on annual leave. Their cover will also have to do that shift pattern.

[Acca Dacca]

How do we know that having Sat and Sun off together dont help with the fatigue if its not been trialled for a good period of time?

As far as I know no non driver has been given that option to trial in any of the pilots

The problem then is when the person doing five days on the trot goes on annual leave. Their cover will also have to do that shift pattern.

Im not sure many reserves would moan about doing Monday-Friday

[Woody Guthrie]

How do we know that having Sat and Sun off together dont help with the fatigue if its not been trialled for a good period of time?

As far as I know no non driver has been given that option to trial in any of the pilots

That happens naturally during the 2 in 5 patterns being trialled.
It happens up and down the country on existing 1 in 4 and 1 in 6 patterns.
We already know that the week we work Monday to Friday is the most tiring of all the weeks and that's before adding in the horrendous Monday and Tuesday.

The members doing the trials are struggling with fatigue after 2-3 days of doing all mail delivery and the drivers are having to rotate every couple of days, some every other day.

We can already understand what 5 days in a row of all mail delivery will do without actually making someone do it constantly.

[Acca Dacca]

How do we know that having Sat and Sun off together dont help with the fatigue if its not been trialled for a good period of time?

As far as I know no non driver has been given that option to trial in any of the pilots

That happens naturally during the 2 in 5 patterns being trialled.
It happens up and down the country on existing 1 in 4 and 1 in 6 patterns.
We already know that the week we work Monday to Friday is the most tiring of all the weeks and that's before adding in the horrendous Monday and Tuesday.

The members doing the trials are struggling with fatigue after 2-3 days of doing all mail delivery and the drivers are having to rotate every couple of days, some every other day.

We can already understand what 5 days in a row of all mail delivery will do without actually making someone do it constantly.

Fair points

[Mr Rush]

How do we know that having Sat and Sun off together dont help with the fatigue if its not been trialled for a good period of time?

We did it nationally in May 2020. It was nice but Monday became a nightmare with double mail, which offset the benefits psychologically.

[Perseus]

How do we know that having Sat and Sun off together dont help with the fatigue if its not been trialled for a good period of time?

As far as I know no non driver has been given that option to trial in any of the pilots

The problem then is when the person doing five days on the trot goes on annual leave. Their cover will also have to do that shift pattern.

Im not sure many reserves would moan about doing Monday-Friday

Most people in my office would take the Monday - Friday, sadly because we are that used to having 2-3 days worth of mail.

[Woody Guthrie]

Most people in my office would take the Monday - Friday, sadly because we are that used to having 2-3 days worth of mail.

They're only used to it if they're completing these duties with 2-3 days mail every day, if not they won't know what's coming.

[Barnacle]

Most people in my office would take the Monday - Friday, sadly because we are that used to having 2-3 days worth of mail.

They're only used to it if they're completing these duties with 2-3 days mail every day, if not they won't know what's coming.

Exactly. If you are clearing several days mail every day and being paid OT that’s one thing. Doing it every day over a longer shift with a higher call rate, is quite another.

[funkflex55]

Most people in my office would take the Monday - Friday, sadly because we are that used to having 2-3 days worth of mail.

They're only used to it if they're completing these duties with 2-3 days mail every day, if not they won't know what's coming.

Yep. Not completing on the new way of working will lead to problems straight away as the walk next time will have 4/5 days mail on it and then you're only getting one walk done at most. Not that it's our problem. If idiotic things are put in place then it's up to idiots in charge to then fix the problems they cause.

[thefox]

About 7 non drivers in our office and all said they would bite your hand off for mon-fri.

[Iva bigredbag]

Sounds bad then you realize you just have to work your hours, if you can't complete then bring it back. Let managers worry about mail brought back, it's not your problem it's theirs that's why they get paid more money. Work your hours then go home.

It's not a matter of what you can't complete.
It's a matter of what you will be expected to do inside your working hours that is causing fatigue in the pilot offices. 5hr+ of double and triple mail every day with no let up, no quiet Monday or Tuesday just relentlessly high call rates every day until retirement, especially for non drivers.

I think a lot of people on this thread have failed to realise that the plan to ensure that there is scope to manage this extra workload is to lengthen each day and have you out on delivery for as much of your working day as possible.

It sounds bad because it is bad.

That leads back to the question of what happens if part timers on 30 hours or lesser weekly contracts dont want to increase their hours? Im guessing the plan is, with a lot less frames needing prepped daily, for the vans to be loaded for them coming in so there will be next to no indoor work for them at all?

That sounds good but then you realize that there will be two+ days of second class mail getting dumped into every office every other day. Then you can watch how much of that gets left in the office as you won't be able to get out of the office in time to complete the round or you hand back a load of your duty because you got out late because two + days of second class mail got dumped into the office. Either way, we don't need to care, work your time and go home and watch the managers stress out as it all goes tits up !