Bosses and union locked in talks

[BernardBresslaw]

Walks need to be 3.5 hours Maximum .

That's fine if you want a predominantly part=time workforce.

5hrs out in all extremes of weather every working day, is not conducive to good health.
Something needs to be done about that.

The problem is, what do you fill the rest of your day with? I have no issue with being out for 5 hours, as long as it's working at a moderate pace.

[meweavy]

Our walks were designed on an old program.
The planners allowed 5 parcels per every 100 houses.
We get 5 parcels on the first loop at least.
Not inc overweights.
They were not planned properly but the managers will never walk test the duties as they know they will not work.

[hubbahubba]

With the massive increase in parcels/tracked etc we see in the MC,i know that however heavy a day we have,that deliveries must be a hell of a lot worse on a day to day basis.

If all the issues (or at least the unrealistic walks and B&H) at DO's aren't addressed by BOTH parties in the talks,then i'm more than happy to go on strike until such times these issues are resolved.

We may all be in different sections/areas,but we are ALL in this together against these cutthroat f^@*ers...

[OnAFlyer]

Our walks were designed on an old program.
The planners allowed 5 parcels per every 100 houses.
We get 5 parcels on the first loop at least.
Not inc overweights.
They were not planned properly but the managers will never walk test the duties as they know they will not work.

Just in the last 2 years since our revision we have had to split some loops in half due to the increase in packets.

[bogstandard]

Meanwhile, the investment banks involved in the valuation of Royal Mail are set to face a grilling by MPs, after being asked by the Business, Innovation and Skills Select Committee to appear before an inquiry later this month. MPs are querying whether the flotation price was set too low.

i went to my stables and saw that all my horses had gone so i decided there and then to bolt the door shut

[Budfrog]

There should be no deal done until the mess that delivery is in gets sorted. Not further talks for sometime in the future, they need a proper and fair plan for delivery now. Park and Loop should never have been agreed under its current terms, it's all about savings and ripping out jobs, not weight off the shoulder. All of it is just time and motion under another name and you can't apply it to Royal Mail deliveries as you can't possibly know what each office is going to get on a daily basis, let alone each walk, there are too many variables-it's guesswork at best. Indoor work is timed to the last second by planners,even down to how long it takes to take yorks to the lift and loading bay with no allowance for anything. The same applies to walks-how long does it take to cross a road or Johnny to answer the door for his packet ? Walks at 4 to 5 hours in the heat of the day or pissing down or snow and ice are too long even taking your breaks (who wants to sit in a van wet through and freezing to eat your sarnies with filthy hands). Walks need to be 3.5 hours Maximum and indoor needs to be doable at a reasonable pace, not timed to every second on forecasts that are way below the actuality.

I agree with much of what you have said in that the workload for deliveries requires a 'drains up' re-assessment of methods used, how work load is built up, duties are structured and BSI targetry (which should be the same for ALL units).

I would be inclined to trial a MC style build up of local PVs by stream for the indoor elements in place of a generic IWT which at best is a little hit and miss. Yes it would take more time and resource but then there would be greater accuracy.

As for the outdoor elements again I would be looking for alternatives to Georoute with a nationwide walk testing program set up with the aim of developing a RM databank of element/task times for this type of work .. again time consuming but the benefits would be a more robust system.

Of course these sort of changes could never happen overnight so there would need to be an agreed temporary fix for units that currently have issues by local agreement.

[meweavy]

Our walks were designed on an old program.
The planners allowed 5 parcels per every 100 houses.
We get 5 parcels on the first loop at least.
Not inc overweights.
They were not planned properly but the managers will never walk test the duties as they know they will not work.

Just in the last 2 years since our revision we have had to split some loops in half due to the increase in packets.

one of the duties in our office can get up to 120 parcels in a day,thats 120 potential form lefts.at 2 minutes each form left.
yet the bosses say the duties work and that its the posties that are the problem and not the duties.

[bogstandard]

Our walks were designed on an old program.
The planners allowed 5 parcels per every 100 houses.
We get 5 parcels on the first loop at least.
Not inc overweights.
They were not planned properly but the managers will never walk test the duties as they know they will not work.

Just in the last 2 years since our revision we have had to split some loops in half due to the increase in packets.

one of the duties in our office can get up to 120 parcels in a day,thats 120 potential form lefts.at 2 minutes each form left.
yet the bosses say the duties work and that its the posties that are the problem and not the duties.

it is true we posties are the problem. Some still think its job and finish. Some believe that when we went to 1 delivery all that was happening was that we didn't have to go back to the office for the day mail and second delivery we could go home. Some think that doing the job properly is others responsibility.
whilst the list isn't endless it does go on.

IMHO we need a change of mindset, that we WILL be working to our times. If we show capacity for extra workload we WILL be found it.
Some of my colleagues at the very least need to take a cold hard look at themselves.

[cubanpete]

Agreed. We are fighting a losing battle, when some muppets come in before their time so the can get out early and back on time. Come in on time. Take your breaks. Use the correct delivery methods and drop what can't be done in your time. It's the only way.

[fishtank]

There should be no deal done until the mess that delivery is in gets sorted.

I don't think that's very likely.
We're running out of time and the last thing we need is a quick fix fudge.
The issues surrounding delivery are very complex and difficult to resolve.

[Chelseablue]

How long has talks went on now ,it's been months n months this women's not interested in giving us a fair deal and the public, the service they used to get . Regarding people coming in early there's a few in our place ,it's like an addiction they can't stop themselves . Over the year imagine how much hours they are doing free now ,,,,for the shareholders .

[Danelectro]

There should be no deal done until the mess that delivery is in gets sorted.

I don't think that's very likely.
We're running out of time and the last thing we need is a quick fix fudge.
The issues surrounding delivery are very complex and difficult to resolve.

So Fish whats the answer? They have been talking since April and had 4 years of park and loop with Gibson as overseer.It may be very complex but we are not trying to split the atom with an elastic band.

We may not need a quick fix fudge but we don't need a slow not fixed fudge either. I agree time is running out but if there is no concessions or acceptance from Royal mail with the threat of IA into xmas pressure then whats the chance of the usual suspects solving anything into the new year.

If the issues are so hard to resolve then lets see the minutes from the talks so every member can see where the f**k we are.

[halfull]

There should be no deal done until the mess that delivery is in gets sorted.

I don't think that's very likely.
We're running out of time and the last thing we need is a quick fix fudge.
The issues surrounding delivery are very complex and difficult to resolve.

So Fish whats the answer? They have been talking since April and had 4 years of park and loop with Gibson as overseer.It may be very complex but we are not trying to split the atom with an elastic band.

We may not need a quick fix fudge but we don't need a slow not fixed fudge either. I agree time is running out but if there is no concessions or acceptance from Royal mail with the threat of IA into xmas pressure then whats the chance of the usual suspects solving anything into the new year.

If the issues are so hard to resolve then lets see the minutes from the talks so every member can see where the f**k we are.

[OnAFlyer]

How long has talks went on now ,it's been months n months this women's not interested in giving us a fair deal and the public, the service they used to get . Regarding people coming in early there's a few in our place ,it's like an addiction they can't stop themselves . Over the year imagine how much hours they are doing free now ,,,,for the shareholders .

I imagine they've made a lot more time than they've given for free, certainly in the past and right up until the last couple of years. Delivery methods revisions are where it all changed.

[fishtank]

So Fish whats the answer?

As far as I can see if the bulk of the other issues are resolved there are four possible scenarios,none of which fill me with joy.

1.The union tells us they have an agreement that resolves the delivery issues in the next couple of days which given the distance between the parties only a few days ago I would trust about as far as I could throw Billy Hayes.

2. The union puts an incomplete agreement in front of the membership with the majority of the issues resolved and promises to resolve the delivery issues at a later date,a promise I would trust about as far as I could throw Dave Ward.

3. The union calls a strike for the 20th of November and uses the next 8 days to try to resolve the differences,this could work but it is a very risky strategy given that RM are likely to release the tasty parts of the "deal" if we call a strike and if no agreement is reached I think the chances of getting the members to the gate over delivery issues only are slim.

4. The union and RM agree another extension which to be honest given the timescales and timing means it's basically all over.

The truth is the answer would have been to kick this whole thing off 4 weeks earlier giving both parties enough time to come up with a credible resolution to the issues in delivery while the threat of Industrial Action was still real.