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Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

26 Jan 2020, 17:59

They can’t use the same walking speed for everyone as it would discriminate between younger and older workers

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

26 Jan 2020, 19:50

terry2972 wrote:They can’t use the same walking speed for everyone as it would discriminate between younger and older workers


That's something you would have to convince an Employment Tribunal of.
That's also assuming the Equality Act survives Brexit and a Tory majority.

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

26 Jan 2020, 21:50

Our delivery office have had 7am starts for years, we have banking of hours and regular absorption to do on a daily basis. The case for Automated Hours Data Capture is interesting because Royal Mail are not going to be paying staff who come in early unpaid. They will use it for those turning up late (for disciplinary's) and for when staff are leaving the office. I suspect they may use this data so that they can roll out the "banking of hours" nationwide on a more official basis. So if you work an hour over your time on Monday, but finished 30 minutes early Tuesday - you would only get paid for 30 minutes. It may keep those who finish early in check as well. So its all win-win for Royal Mail.

But the fact that this and other things which are un-agreed with the CWU is very concerning. The company is deliberately trying to steamroller its objectives head-on into transforming the business regardless, putting profits before people. The CWU will have no choice to ballot its members for another strike ballot because the company just haven't offered its workers anything in return. I can see the company offering us a few crumbs into accepting their new proposals though, just like last time.....

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

26 Jan 2020, 22:13

viking1488 wrote:
Newbie001 wrote:The next logical step after clocking in/out. Would be banking hours.
Having worked in an industry that used it, that is the one the union should fight tooth and nail. On paper sounds ok but in reality an absolute nightmare.

i believe your right on this one ive heard people talking about clocking in and out and what if you finish early banking hours and take xmas pressure/people on the sick in your office they will come and get them hours back off you so for the runners this might be a huge problem as you might see yourself working overtime days off etc just for the fun of it i have also worked in an industry where they used this system and yes its a ball ache and there is not a lot you can do about it as your due them the time and 10 min here 10 mins there soon adds up

The business I worked in, they used banking hours to effectively end all overtime for everyone. Experienced managers where expected to be clairvoyant and predict how many hours you would do each day, according to how busy it "might" be.
Of course it also goes tits up when someone goes sick, family emergencies, or holidays. We ended up owing some staff hundreds of hours. I myself didnt have to work notice when I left because I was owed so many hours.
Now imagine current RM managers trying to make a similar system work and try to tie it into workload schedule.

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

26 Jan 2020, 22:16

Woody Guthrie wrote:
terry2972 wrote:They can’t use the same walking speed for everyone as it would discriminate between younger and older workers


That's something you would have to convince an Employment Tribunal of.
That's also assuming the Equality Act survives Brexit and a Tory majority.

I would have thought that not using a standard speed for all workers would be what would fall foul of the EA (use of age)

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

26 Jan 2020, 23:50

Whats happens in the offices that have a lower percentage of posties who drive for RM?

6 duties - three drivers, three non drivers paired together

1 of the drivers gets taken off his walk to do the PKTS/LAT delivery

2 Driver/Non Driver pairings absorb his walk leaving a non driver who was partnered with the PKT driver who can do bugger all without a driver

I dont think they have thought this through

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

26 Jan 2020, 23:59

Acca Dacca wrote:Whats happens in the offices that have a lower percentage of posties who drive for RM?

6 duties - three drivers, three non drivers paired together

1 of the drivers gets taken off his walk to do the PKTS/LAT delivery

2 Driver/Non Driver pairings absorb his walk leaving a non driver who was partnered with the PKT driver who can do bugger all without a driver

I dont think they have thought this through

What if someone who does a HCT round can drive? They might get swapped with the non-driver from one of the pairs

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

27 Jan 2020, 00:00

SpacePhoenix wrote:
Acca Dacca wrote:Whats happens in the offices that have a lower percentage of posties who drive for RM?

6 duties - three drivers, three non drivers paired together

1 of the drivers gets taken off his walk to do the PKTS/LAT delivery

2 Driver/Non Driver pairings absorb his walk leaving a non driver who was partnered with the PKT driver who can do bugger all without a driver

I dont think they have thought this through

What if someone who does a HCT round can drive? They might get swapped with the non-driver from one of the pairs


Many offices with no HCT duties at all - including mine

And any there are, are likely to be taken by non drivers already.

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

27 Jan 2020, 00:17

Acca Dacca wrote:
SpacePhoenix wrote:
Acca Dacca wrote:Whats happens in the offices that have a lower percentage of posties who drive for RM?

6 duties - three drivers, three non drivers paired together

1 of the drivers gets taken off his walk to do the PKTS/LAT delivery

2 Driver/Non Driver pairings absorb his walk leaving a non driver who was partnered with the PKT driver who can do bugger all without a driver

I dont think they have thought this through

What if someone who does a HCT round can drive? They might get swapped with the non-driver from one of the pairs


Many offices with no HCT duties at all - including mine

And any there are, are likely to be taken by non drivers already.


Compulsory transfer of someone from another office with the replaced non-driver becoming a reserve (or moving to the other office)?

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

27 Jan 2020, 13:00

postslippete wrote: So if you work an hour over your time on Monday, but finished 30 minutes early Tuesday - you would only get paid for 30 minutes. It may keep those who finish early in check as well. So its all win-win for Royal Mail.


That's what happens in other companies so why should royal mail employees be any different?

The issues are that its never been enforced by management at delivery office level or if it was it was only used against those with oversized duties and would cut off or not do lapsing on a regular basis. We all know the managers line when you say you can't complete "if you get back early you can't go home" :roll:

CWU's problems come if the company wants to roll it out to an annualised or monthly system and then the poo will hit the fan because it will be so hard to keep track of who's done what when where and how much. It'll be chaos because they can't even get peoples holidays right never mind throwing worked hours into the mix. And if they owe you you know they'll never agree to a system that allows you to finish earlier rather than take it as overtime if you had something on that day.

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

27 Jan 2020, 13:50

if they bring banking hours in, its very simple, just cut off at your time and bring the mail back.
When have the office brings it back and people refuse to do overtime to clear it because they aint getting paid in full ( even the docket suckers wont do it for free) then they will have to have a little rethink.

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

27 Jan 2020, 18:08

leolion855 wrote:if they bring banking hours in, its very simple, just cut off at your time and bring the mail back.
When have the office brings it back and people refuse to do overtime to clear it because they aint getting paid in full ( even the docket suckers wont do it for free) then they will have to have a little rethink.


I agree with you, it’s going to fall down as if you don’t get paid in full, the fantastic overtime rate lol, who’s going to go over on the Monday certainly not me

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

27 Jan 2020, 22:21

Acca Dacca wrote:Whats happens in the offices that have a lower percentage of posties who drive for RM?

6 duties - three drivers, three non drivers paired together

1 of the drivers gets taken off his walk to do the PKTS/LAT delivery

2 Driver/Non Driver pairings absorb his walk leaving a non driver who was partnered with the PKT driver who can do bugger all without a driver

I dont think they have thought this through



At Royal Mail they have only recently employed posties who can drive. What happens if the driver has been taken off driving and cannot pass the driver changeover?? :hmmmm

I tell you what happens - the pressure is off. Because the postie driver is responsible for collecting and delivering the Specials, the slightly larger (but not quite as large as shoebox) packets that the non-driver refuses to take cause they won't take a trolley; and now quite possibly a LAT delivery

Are there any advantages to doing a LAT delivery?? Can you leave and go home early if you've only got a dozen packets to deliver - or will you be forced to deliver loops as well cause the business wants us to work to our times?

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

27 Jan 2020, 22:30

Are there any advantages to doing a LAT delivery??


It's a driving job so by definition a piece of piss.

The hours will suit some people, no more early rises and falling asleep at dinner.

Unlikely to be much contact with management.

You'll be earning far more than the Yodel, DPD and Hermes guys doing practically the same job.

No more D2D....

You get to see your mates hanging about outside the pub.

You get to listen to Steve Wright on radio 2 and pretend it's the 80s again.

The list is very exhaustive.

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

28 Jan 2020, 12:22

Woody Guthrie wrote:
Are there any advantages to doing a LAT delivery??


It's a driving job so by definition a piece of piss.

The hours will suit some people, no more early rises and falling asleep at dinner.

Unlikely to be much contact with management.

You'll be earning far more than the Yodel, DPD and Hermes guys doing practically the same job.

No more D2D....

You get to see your mates hanging about outside the pub.

You get to listen to Steve Wright on radio 2 and pretend it's the 80s again.

The list is very exhaustive.


Ha, ha, steady! Put in those terms it sounds quite appealing...

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

28 Jan 2020, 13:10

Everything will come in.
There will be terms of reference, joint statements and 'the words'.

It will of course be interpreted differently by management to what The CWU says it means.
Managers will f**k things up per the norm.
Colleagues will find a way to f**k it up for the next colleague due on the next shift.

Bullying will go up because of all of the above and more.

Film at 11...always read the label...may contain nuts...not dishwasher safe...

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

28 Jan 2020, 18:50

Woody Guthrie wrote:
Are there any advantages to doing a LAT delivery??


It's a driving job so by definition a piece of piss.

The hours will suit some people, no more early rises and falling asleep at dinner.

Unlikely to be much contact with management.

You'll be earning far more than the Yodel, DPD and Hermes guys doing practically the same job.

No more D2D....

You get to see your mates hanging about outside the pub.

You get to listen to Steve Wright on radio 2 and pretend it's the 80s again.

The list is very exhaustive.


LAT driver here, can tell you it isn't all sunshine and rainbows.

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

29 Jan 2020, 02:45

NorthernPostman wrote:
Woody Guthrie wrote:
Are there any advantages to doing a LAT delivery??


It's a driving job so by definition a piece of piss.

The hours will suit some people, no more early rises and falling asleep at dinner.

Unlikely to be much contact with management.

You'll be earning far more than the Yodel, DPD and Hermes guys doing practically the same job.

No more D2D....

You get to see your mates hanging about outside the pub.

You get to listen to Steve Wright on radio 2 and pretend it's the 80s again.

The list is very exhaustive.


LAT driver here, can tell you it isn't all sunshine and rainbows.


Yeah, wait till you get all the 'small' parcels from walkers who say they're too big to take, then having 'discussions' with management about unacheivable workload.

Rush hour traffic? Just relax with the soothing sound of pan pipes on Radio 4.

Or how about trying to locate a rural address in the dark when the SATNAV is trying to direct you into the nearby river.

Yeah, it ain't all that...

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

29 Jan 2020, 07:51

ssdd wrote:Yeah, wait till you get all the 'small' parcels from walkers who say they're too big to take, then having 'discussions' with management about unacheivable workload.

AFAIK with the new parcel strategy, the walkers will only take out parcels that will fit through a letter box

Dispute Update : Today Royal Mail have announced executive action in 15 different offices across the UK.

29 Jan 2020, 08:20

SpacePhoenix wrote:
ssdd wrote:Yeah, wait till you get all the 'small' parcels from walkers who say they're too big to take, then having 'discussions' with management about unacheivable workload.

AFAIK with the new parcel strategy, the walkers will only take out parcels that will fit through a letter box



RM have said only items above shoebox size. Don't know what size shoe they're using as reference

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