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Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

An 'unofficial' forum for those who either work for Royal Mail or are looking to work for Royal Mail through the Angard Staffing Agency.This is an open forum.
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beau1
Posts: 4
Joined: 12 Jan 2012, 06:05
Gender: Male

Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by beau1 »

Don't really want to mention any names or locations here as I don't think my frustration here is with an individual or person, its with the whole Royal Mail system and protocol.

I was sacked today after a week and a half on the job, for the 'wilful delay of the Queen's Mail', something which I knew could well happen (despite never actually being told this) however it seems there is completely no lee-way on the matter.

Take my situation for example, on Tuesday I started a new round which took me 4 hours and ended it at roughly 5pm just as light started fading.

Move on to Wednesday, I normally start at 1PM however, Royal Mail cocks up so I'm not ready to leave until 2 and to my surprise I find that I've got twice the amount of the day before. I do most of the round, in about 4 hours again and by this time its 6:15 and getting too dark to see and the remaining street (one long street) is one that I have never done before. I worked out that with amount of mail I have, it would take about an hour in the light but taking into account the light it would have probably taken me and hour and a half which would have meant people would have received mail at around 7:45pm.

So what do I do? Considering I've never been given a contact number for this situation, I take the intiative and decide that I will do the mail, early on the next morning before I go in at 1PM. Unfortunatly, my manager rings me up at 10 asking how I get on, being the honest soul I am I tell him 'I did 4 hours yesterday but I had mail left over so I'm going to do that now', thinking about it now I should have just lied and said it took me 6 and a half hours and gone and done it anyway.

To cut a long story short, he asks me to take the mail back to the delivery centre and sacks me on the spot which led to me having a 20 minute 'argument' about how it was them who actually 'f****d up' and not me.

Just a couple of reasons why I didn't carry on after 6:30pm

1. It was pitch dark on a road I did not know, I hadn't been supplied with a torch (apparently they don't...) and therefore couldn't read either door number until I went up the path (making the job even longer... or less accurate) nor the letters I was holding.

2. Under the grounds of health and safety, I didn't want to be blundering around people's gardens in area I did not know, added to that some of these houses were suitable awkward as they were rear entry only and meant I'd have to open gates and go through their back gardens, all of this in a pretty rough area.

3. I couldn't actually do the job anymore as it was so dark. As I said before, I hadn't been given a contact number for this situation and the likely scenerio is that even if I had, I doubt I'd been able to get hold of a manager on delivery at 6:30pm.

4. For me personally, I probably wouldn't answer my door in the dark after 7pm until I knew it was someone coming around my house. You do not expect the postman to be there with a parcel for you to sign or trying to stuff things through your letterbox because they can not see. I've NEVER known for a postman to deliver after 5PM let alone 7.

I get the protocol and apparently they are doing a lot of changes in my area, but this is complete bullshit if you ask me. It wasn't MY fault that they f****d up and my round had too much for me to be able to complete and it wasn't 'wilful' delay because I wasn't actually able to do the job anymore...rant over.

I've got to be honest though, I'm kind of glad in a way, I wouldn't want to be delivering in the dark with all sorts of people saying 'why is the mail being delivered at 7:30pm, we normally have it before 12?'

Just to point out, I had no fixed hours but was told that we would be out there '3-4 hours each day', not 6 or 7 and going into conditions when I could not see due to diminishing light.

P.S This topic perhaps should be moved, its not really too relevant to Angard specifically apart from the fact I am employed through them.

Didius
Posts: 5
Joined: 19 Nov 2011, 19:44
Gender: Male

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by Didius »

Your probably best off out of it, think i'd of smacked the prick for good measure.
markadam1962
Posts: 246
Joined: 11 Oct 2010, 17:19
Gender: Male

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by markadam1962 »

Begs the question where was the "wilful delay" in sending someone out late in the afternoon. Hats off for initative...but thats frowned upon I believe.

Bring on the next Angreed slave! :wave
DGP1
Posts: 15551
Joined: 07 Jun 2007, 20:39
Gender: Male
Location: Terminus

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by DGP1 »

TBH you weren't sacked for 'wilful delay', they just ended your casual contract.
Is it right? No it's not.
Is it right that someone should be just sent out somewhere without any training and expect them to just do everything without complaint?.............no it's not.

Most managers are so devoid of all people skills that I'm surprised that they can even talk to people let alone instruct them to do a job, which isin't difficult but it does take a while to actually get used to it and this is the what is wrong, people who are trained for several days on a delivery are better able to do the job and stay..........

Must calm down :mad :mad :mad :mad
I'm preparing myself for the zombie invasion, rule number 1 - Cardio
LeftFootRight
Posts: 6
Joined: 11 Feb 2012, 22:19
Gender: Male

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by LeftFootRight »

"The Queens mail", what a joke. Everything is "The Queen's" this and that and everything belongs to her.

Sorry to hear about your story mate, my local postman is a pest and you get saked while he keeps his job!. I don't want him to lose his job and be responsible for no income, as he's from another country, I am planning a way to put him on a different route by sending a request to RM.
Lounge Lizard
EX ROYAL MAIL
Posts: 9458
Joined: 06 Aug 2007, 21:54

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by Lounge Lizard »

LeftFootRight wrote:"The Queens mail", what a joke. Everything is "The Queen's" this and that and everything belongs to her.

Sorry to hear about your story mate, my local postman is a pest and you get saked while he keeps his job!. I don't want him to lose his job and be responsible for no income, as he's from another country, I am planning a way to put him on a different route by sending a request to RM.
Is your local postman a pest to an extent that breaks any law ? :shock:
And what's the relevance of him being from another country, working here illegally ? :shock:
As for "planning a way to put him on a different route by sending a request to RM" there's no chance of that. :Very Happy
andy2007
Posts: 3971
Joined: 14 Sep 2007, 10:16
Gender: Male
Location: Earth

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by andy2007 »

If you'd been a permanent Postie, and did what you did, the Manager would be right. But that's because we're all aware that it's illegal to take the Mail Home with us. However: from what you”ve said, it appears that you didn't know that. So he was wrong to sack you for Wilful Delay. You're not a mind reader. So how were you supposed to know what to do in that situation?
If I were you, I'd try to get some legal advice. I've no idea if you have any legal recourse, because you worked for RM through an Agency. But it's worth you asking. You might get lucky, and be able to fight this disgraceful treatment.

Good luck.
Don't knock Insanity
it's just another outlook on Reality!
admiraldill
Posts: 1
Joined: 11 Sep 2014, 08:48
Gender: Male

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by admiraldill »

Willful delay is much cheaper than paying overtime to do the job properly. I have brought back a huge amount of mail today on the advise of my "manager". First time in thirty-five years ( without snow on the ground )."Lapsing" 137 more calls makes the job impossible. Feel s**t . Who knows what hospital appointments, sympathy / birthday cards, important messages are sitting in the back of my van ? I know I'm not supposed to care. The sooner they get rid of us old farts who were trained to do the job properly the better. Up the Union ( Wherever they are........... ).
Taha123
Posts: 1
Joined: 02 Jun 2021, 19:01
Gender: Male

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by Taha123 »

Iv recently reported 30,000 parcels that were not reported reported by senior management which included Covid Kits and Bowel Cancer screening tests and alarmingly nothing happened. Covid kits were sat in the main centre for almost 2 weeks.
I then contacted the whistle blow helpline and yesterday when i logged on weeks later to see if there is any update, they closed the case🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️.
Norfolk 'N' Chance
Posts: 231
Joined: 25 Aug 2021, 18:15
Gender: Male
Location: In the Stix

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by Norfolk 'N' Chance »

beau1 wrote:
10 Feb 2012, 00:34
Don't really want to mention any names or locations here as I don't think my frustration here is with an individual or person, its with the whole Royal Mail system and protocol.

I was sacked today after a week and a half on the job, for the 'wilful delay of the Queen's Mail', something which I knew could well happen (despite never actually being told this) however it seems there is completely no lee-way on the matter.

Take my situation for example, on Tuesday I started a new round which took me 4 hours and ended it at roughly 5pm just as light started fading.

Move on to Wednesday, I normally start at 1PM however, Royal Mail cocks up so I'm not ready to leave until 2 and to my surprise I find that I've got twice the amount of the day before. I do most of the round, in about 4 hours again and by this time its 6:15 and getting too dark to see and the remaining street (one long street) is one that I have never done before. I worked out that with amount of mail I have, it would take about an hour in the light but taking into account the light it would have probably taken me and hour and a half which would have meant people would have received mail at around 7:45pm.

So what do I do? Considering I've never been given a contact number for this situation, I take the intiative and decide that I will do the mail, early on the next morning before I go in at 1PM. Unfortunatly, my manager rings me up at 10 asking how I get on, being the honest soul I am I tell him 'I did 4 hours yesterday but I had mail left over so I'm going to do that now', thinking about it now I should have just lied and said it took me 6 and a half hours and gone and done it anyway.

To cut a long story short, he asks me to take the mail back to the delivery centre and sacks me on the spot which led to me having a 20 minute 'argument' about how it was them who actually 'f****d up' and not me.

Just a couple of reasons why I didn't carry on after 6:30pm

1. It was pitch dark on a road I did not know, I hadn't been supplied with a torch (apparently they don't...) and therefore couldn't read either door number until I went up the path (making the job even longer... or less accurate) nor the letters I was holding.

2. Under the grounds of health and safety, I didn't want to be blundering around people's gardens in area I did not know, added to that some of these houses were suitable awkward as they were rear entry only and meant I'd have to open gates and go through their back gardens, all of this in a pretty rough area.

3. I couldn't actually do the job anymore as it was so dark. As I said before, I hadn't been given a contact number for this situation and the likely scenerio is that even if I had, I doubt I'd been able to get hold of a manager on delivery at 6:30pm.

4. For me personally, I probably wouldn't answer my door in the dark after 7pm until I knew it was someone coming around my house. You do not expect the postman to be there with a parcel for you to sign or trying to stuff things through your letterbox because they can not see. I've NEVER known for a postman to deliver after 5PM let alone 7.

I get the protocol and apparently they are doing a lot of changes in my area, but this is complete bullshit if you ask me. It wasn't MY fault that they f****d up and my round had too much for me to be able to complete and it wasn't 'wilful' delay because I wasn't actually able to do the job anymore...rant over.

I've got to be honest though, I'm kind of glad in a way, I wouldn't want to be delivering in the dark with all sorts of people saying 'why is the mail being delivered at 7:30pm, we normally have it before 12?'

Just to point out, I had no fixed hours but was told that we would be out there '3-4 hours each day', not 6 or 7 and going into conditions when I could not see due to diminishing light.

P.S This topic perhaps should be moved, its not really too relevant to Angard specifically apart from the fact I am employed through them.
Sorry to hear this mate and does seem like unfair treatment. However reading this im glad that ive been staying out with the foxes and vampires for 9hrs plus to complete my deliveries. I totally agree with you though, I was doing rural letters at 6pm ish the other saturday and in darkness its bloody slow!
Jellyfish987654321
Posts: 4
Joined: 08 Dec 2021, 16:43
Gender: Female

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by Jellyfish987654321 »

Taha123 wrote:
18 Nov 2021, 07:12
Iv recently reported 30,000 parcels that were not reported reported by senior management which included Covid Kits and Bowel Cancer screening tests and alarmingly nothing happened. Covid kits were sat in the main centre for almost 2 weeks.
I then contacted the whistle blow helpline and yesterday when i logged on weeks later to see if there is any update, they closed the case🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️.
Maybe you should take that story to the papers! but then I guess you would lose your job :/
kazardaimenu
Posts: 645
Joined: 13 Apr 2022, 19:11
Gender: Male

Re: Sacked for 'Wilful' delay

Post by kazardaimenu »

The new revisions are wilfully delaying mail. Just be sure to take the mail back to the office and let the manager know, dump it in his office for good measure.
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