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Fair Dismissal for 20 year Postie - ET Decision - Not locking the Van

14 May 2019, 16:16

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... gment_.pdf

This is a long document and its formatting won't allow it to be posted easily. However, I urge anyone who drives for Royal Mail to read and be guided by it.

Even though RM made mistakes, and technically breached their own policies, the Judge deemed dismissal was fair.

Fair Dismissal for 20 year Postie - ET Decision - Not locking the Van

14 May 2019, 17:23

Makes you question whether or not to actually drive for Royal Mail, not as if you get paid for it , fair enough he made an error of judgement ,how many of us take the same risks daily and get away with it, I won't anymore. He was the victim of an opportunistic theft, of which he was partly culpable I suppose, still think dismissal was a very harsh penalty.

Fair Dismissal for 20 year Postie - ET Decision - Not locking the Van

15 May 2019, 10:22

rubberbond wrote:Makes you question whether or not to actually drive for Royal Mail, not as if you get paid for it , fair enough he made an error of judgement ,how many of us take the same risks daily and get away with it, I won't anymore. He was the victim of an opportunistic theft, of which he was partly culpable I suppose, still think dismissal was a very harsh penalty.

You make many valid points! For drivers the easier duty carrot is now a long gone luxury.
Think of speeding instances to make time! Making time for collections due to traffic/road works/accidents! Illegal parking to deliver parcels etc. The list of driving related offences is endless but the main reason for any driving posties infringements are mainly TIME related, and that is where RM are culpable, they have created that chicken run mentality.
The PRESSURE now being exerted on drivers is grossly unfair while their heads are left firmly on the chopping block.
The onus on drivers responsibility is huge by comparison to a non driving postie for the exact same money.
And why anyone would wish to place their own personal driving ability at risk while being employed by a company who are getting more and more performance targeted with all the added pressure that entails is mysterious. RM simply hide behind any pressure related argument by simply saying they do not force or ask drivers to break the law or take undue risks.
The reality is “very” different. Work loads on drivers do not allow for anywhere near sufficient TIME anymore.
Driving posties do no fully realise the HUGE imposed responsibility they take on when they are doing the box ticking exercise in place for van checks for example, RM are wearing blinkers while in the full knowledge that they can produce a paper trail to cover their arse. They willingly add as much work onto drivers as possible in the full knowledge that someone else is bearing all the risks while they hypocritically sit back and say it is not their responsibility, shameless hypocrites.
ps, rubberbond! Prepare yourself for the repercussions of “ doing the job properly”, while carrying out all the driving imposed responsibilities by RM. you will hardly complete your first loop, securely locking all doors then walking round the van before reversing/moving etc, things that RM love to impose only to place all faults occurring onto the driver, always!

Fair Dismissal for 20 year Postie - ET Decision - Not locking the Van

15 May 2019, 14:03

It's not rocket science, every time you get out van, take keys and lock it. Simple. If doing the job correctly makes you later, fair enough, either claim or cut off.

Fair Dismissal for 20 year Postie - ET Decision - Not locking the Van

15 May 2019, 16:11

rambo1 wrote:It's not rocket science, every time you get out van, take keys and lock it. Simple. If doing the job correctly makes you later, fair enough, either claim or cut off.

If only real life was just that black and white. No matter how thorough one can be with checks etc...just occasionally one makes an error. We are after all just human.. not machines.

Fair Dismissal for 20 year Postie - ET Decision - Not locking the Van

15 May 2019, 16:25

rambo1 wrote:It's not rocket science, every time you get out van, take keys and lock it. Simple. If doing the job correctly makes you later, fair enough, either claim or cut off.

That is very true and that would be RMs stance.
We all know the reality is different.
Especially with single parcel delivery, would everyone, allowing for the mundane repetition of locking stop/starting the van, stick to it? I doubt very many do it in all circumstances when leaving the van. This is not saying it is acceptable in any way and in situations that go wrong you would not have a leg to stand on. It is just another downside of being a RM driver I’m afraid, much more future job security pounding the streets with a spare key to let yourself back in the van when on P&l!!

Fair Dismissal for 20 year Postie - ET Decision - Not locking the Van

15 May 2019, 16:30

Hey if that's what RM want you to do, just do it. Is it worth losing your job? Get into the routine of taking keys out every time you stop and get out and it becomes second nature. OK, you may not be able to get a flyer cos it's taking you longer, but you'll still have a job.

Fair Dismissal for 20 year Postie - ET Decision - Not locking the Van

15 May 2019, 18:18

Ok I'm sorry the guy lost his job but I've only read as far as the 2nd line where it says he left the van unlocked with the engine running ! Come on I don't think even Mr loophole could have got him off this one.

Fair Dismissal for 20 year Postie - ET Decision - Not locking the Van

16 May 2019, 06:10

tommyrep wrote:
rambo1 wrote:It's not rocket science, every time you get out van, take keys and lock it. Simple. If doing the job correctly makes you later, fair enough, either claim or cut off.

That is very true and that would be RMs stance.
We all know the reality is different.
Especially with single parcel delivery, would everyone, allowing for the mundane repetition of locking stop/starting the van, stick to it? I doubt very many do it in all circumstances when leaving the van. This is not saying it is acceptable in any way and in situations that go wrong you would not have a leg to stand on. It is just another downside of being a RM driver I’m afraid, much more future job security pounding the streets with a spare key to let yourself back in the van when on P&l!!


Going by the look of the download, the chairman of the ET had no clue as to what cutting off actually is against saying RM allow staff to finish their shift earlier( bull)=ALL HOURS WORKED. And why would you go to a ET without a union lawyer or someone who knows how they operate.

Fair Dismissal for 20 year Postie - ET Decision - Not locking the Van

16 May 2019, 12:43

rambo1 wrote:It's not rocket science, every time you get out van, take keys and lock it. Simple. If doing the job correctly makes you later, fair enough, either claim or cut off.

Sounds simple enough! Reality is very different, many cannot face the inevitable accusations of being a poor performer by managers and a few colleagues are well.

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