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Annual Leave 'Review'

04 Aug 2019, 08:58

Good Morning. I would like a bit of information/ advice, if anyone can help. Sorry about it being a little long-winded.

I work in a SPDO and we have all just received letters from our area manager with a annual leave print out attached which says she has been doing a review of all annual leave remaining for everybody in her area.
She has crossed through the number of hours carried forward and wrote a new figure in there which she says is the correct amount.

Everybody in our office has had thier remaining annual leave hours reduced in this way by an amount which equates to about 3 or 4 weeks. We have all carried forward, with the agreement of management, a good 15/20 days over the last few years because of staff shortages which has resulted in us having our annual leave requests refused.

It says in the letter that she has been going over our annual leave taken over the last 5 years and the hours that we have been shown to carry forward is incorrect. Although every year in April we have had our annual leave sheets back, showing amount of days taken and amount remaining/carried forward.

She is coming to each office in her area to go through her new data with each employee individually to show us why she has reduced everybody's remaining annual leave.

We are worried that she is going to come in, and for example, say that you had a week off in October 2014, a week in May 2015 etc that was not previously recorded on our past yearly sheets and that she is now taking those hours off our entitlement.

I have spoken to about 7 or 8 others in my office and they have all had their carried forward amount reduced by between 3 and 5 weeks. Is she able to do this? How are we supposed to remember what weeks we've took off up to 5 years ago?

Thanks for any advice.

Annual Leave 'Review'

04 Aug 2019, 12:29

I can only suggest you ask your line manager to obtain a copy of all leave taken (5 year record) via PSP.

I have edited this recent post which may assist you, notably;
"Through the exercise all employees should be provided with a copy of their individual leave card and confirm that they agree with their entitlement, carried forward and outstanding leave. Where the figures are disputed Local managers and Representatives shall work with the individuals affected to understand the reasons for the disputed figure and work together to resolve the difference"


LTB 409/19 - Joint Review of Annual Leave Arrangements
Postby TrueBlueTerrier » Sun Jul 07, 2019 12:47 pm

Attachment 1 – JS Annual Leave Arrangements 04.07.19 https://emails.cwu.org/t/d-l-pkylihy-jtfltzjh-d/

JOINT STATEMENT BETWEEN ROYAL MAIL AND THE COMMUNICATION WORKERS
UNION IN REGARD TO A JOINT REVIEW OF ANNUAL LEAVE ARRANGEMENTS

Mandatory Review of the Current Annual Leave Position by Unit

It has proven to be a challenge to accurately establish the current state regarding outstanding annual leave as many units have not used PSP correctly, including not
recording outstanding leave properly. The aim of the review is to find a mutual interest solution that enables employees to take leave at short notice or indeed provide enough slots for contractual and purchase leave to be taken across the whole leave year.
This is an issue which we have jointly agreed to place renewed focus on in 2019 with the aim to agree improved processes for 2019/2020 leave year, ready for the annual leave
allocation process in October 2019.

In July 2019, it is mandatory that all unit managers and local representatives will review and agree through their resourcing meeting, their current position in terms of annual leave allocation and outstanding entitlement for their respective unit.

1. Completed an individual review with each employee
2. Discussed their plan to allocate outstanding annual leave
3. Ensured that where individuals have outstanding unallocated leave, enough leave has been booked to cover purchased leave
4. Carried out the joint review activity with full involvement of the CWU


Through the exercise all employees should be provided with a copy of their individual leave card and confirm that they agree with their entitlement, carried forward and outstanding leave. Where the figures are disputed Local managers and Representatives shall work with the individuals affected to understand the reasons for the disputed figure and work together to resolve the difference

Annual Leave 'Review'

04 Aug 2019, 18:35

Thanks for the reply.
I just can't understand how they can provide you with a leave card every year showing the leave taken and leave carried forward and then try to tell you that these were wrong up to 5 years later.

Annual Leave 'Review'

04 Aug 2019, 20:43

rogersh wrote:In July 2019, it is mandatory that all unit managers and local representatives will review and agree through their resourcing meeting, their current position in terms of annual leave allocation and outstanding entitlement for their respective unit


really?? nothing at ours that i know of

Annual Leave 'Review'

04 Aug 2019, 22:13

stoneybroke wrote:Thanks for the reply.
I just can't understand how they can provide you with a leave card every year showing the leave taken and leave carried forward and then try to tell you that these were wrong up to 5 years later.


If the figure has been changed the onus is on them to provide a detailed explanation. If disputed I would request to see the records used in the calculation.

I disputed the carried over hours on my annual leave card this year (the first I have ever seen) minus 8 instead of plus 4 - this equates to 3 days leave for me.
I was able to provide a record of my annual leave since I started with RM in 2013 as I had noted on calendars. This was accepted by my line manager & adjusted accordingly.

Annual Leave 'Review'

05 Aug 2019, 20:50

The same happened to me last year, of course I provided dates/walks I did/hours worked instead of being in holiday and all sorted.
I have a calendar too :crazy:

Annual Leave 'Review'

05 Aug 2019, 21:04

I've got a diary for 2018 and 2019 with all details of walks,hours worked and holidays etc but in the letter they are disputing everybody's leave going back 5 years. Not sure how we'll be able to prove what leave we've taken in the previous years. Apparently they're disputing the carried forward figures.

Annual Leave 'Review'

06 Aug 2019, 07:21

I am a sub area rep. There is a national agreement , released as an LTB. This agreement states that all annual leave will be reviewed. This review will be done by each OPG and his/ her manager sitting down, with the rep present, and checking their individual leave. If there are any discrepancies then these will be investigated. This is mandatory , every OPG must check their own leave.

Annual Leave 'Review'

06 Aug 2019, 17:24

All this crap has something to do with a case that was brought in the European Court of Justice that said that all employers must be pro-active(ha ha in Royal Mail :roll: )in enabling staff to take their holidays.

Employers must ensure they give staff the opportunity to take their holiday. This does not mean that they must force staff to take it but they will have to encourage them to do so. This is likely to entail regular reminders during the course of the holiday year that they should be taking their holiday, perhaps providing details of the untaken holiday entitlement, and warnings that if they do not take it they will lose it. Where an employer does not do this, the worker will be able to carry over their untaken holiday entitlement into a subsequent holiday year. This is despite the “use it or lose it” approach in the Working Time Regulations 1998 (WTR) - which provide that holiday must be taken in the leave year in which it accrues. Workers will also be entitled to a payment in lieu of their untaken holiday on termination, including holiday carried over from a previous holiday year.

Annual Leave 'Review'

11 Aug 2019, 09:21

Usually this happens due to staff shortages which have a knock on effect because the number of AL slots relates to how many staff there are in a DO. A long while back with our previous DOM this went on for years so when it got to the end of the pick for AL weeks there were not any left. Days in lieu could never be booked either. When the new DOM arrived and started to get everything sorted out the backlog was cleared but there was a cut off date so RM claimed they could only go back so many years. I keep diaries so was fairly certain what I was owed. In the end I think I lost about a couple of weeks of days in lieu.
It's always like this with RM though. They are continually looking to save a few pence on their end but then if we do more work they almost refuse to pay for it.

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