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Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

12 Sep 2020, 21:06

Well does it but before my rage upon free market economics I would say if it can be harnessed by individuals who have the will and foresight for their own ambitions to the folk who earned their wealth it would not be a bad thing if they did share there gains like some mill owners did they built houses schools and swimming pools and library's and gave some of there own wealth to make a community. But in these times dog eat dog applies it would need a big dog but some selfish bastard just stole money from the NHS and us all just sat on a boat thousands of miles away here https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... cheap.html Well this Is why capitalism sucks the life out of the nation!

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

12 Sep 2020, 21:27

Capitalism is what pays eveyones pensions.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

12 Sep 2020, 21:37

rambo1 wrote:Capitalism is what pays eveyones pensions.

So why was Chancellor Otto von Bismarck called a 'socialist' for creating the world's first contributory retirement benefits program? :wink:

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

12 Sep 2020, 21:49

For capitalism is a self serving entity it is cash/money hungry beast if you don't have it your nobody if you have it your somebody. I would like to think the intelligence of someone does not come with a blank cheque but alas for some mommy and daddy will pay for these hero's of the nation for educational reasons and not through leadership who would have thought a fat oik Born in New York the USA folks would become our leader of our nation I know he rejected his USA ties as he would pay dual taxation even I don't agree with that. As to the class structure the whole nation is in need of repair it is not just here and there the political weight of the south has transformed anything north of the Watford gap a Barron and desolate land just go to London and compare! We can be accustomed to our surroundings anyone from London thinks they have arrived in Beirut if they travel up here, This is a failure in the capitalist system it in no way reflects upon the quality of the staff but the ease of access and the banking system ie removing capital as soon as you put it in! This is but a portent of what can be said of this system In time to come I would gladly welcome those who can contribute to the whole society but most want to take and run and hide on a boat 3000 miles away as well as steal from us all with more taxation because he don't pay tax. Well I don't call him sir he is a second rate punk!

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 01:01

Hate these rich people lording it over us, taking us out the EU to boost their hedge funds, trying to privatise the NHS, and not paying their taxes.

But do like a cheeky MacD's.

Got to be a good balance there somewhere.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 01:17

It could be worse, imgaine having socialism fronted by jeremy corbyn.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 06:20

We don't have anything like true Free Market Capitalism in this country, our political/economic system is Corporatism, Neoliberalism, Oligarchy...

We have a complete corruption of just how true Free Market Capitalism is supposed to operate and the OP's link illustrates perfectly just how far removed we are from true Free Market Capitalism.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 09:50

Capitalism is just a word without much meaning.

It doesn't really matter who owns the means of production the working class always get screwed over.

Wealth is like energy, it cannot be created or destroyed it can only change from one type to another or in the case of money from one grubby set of hands to another. Printing money doesn't create wealth it just dilutes it, making smartphones doesn't create wealth it just redistributes it.

The problem we have at the moment is the inherent flaw in the capitalist system, as there is only a finite pool of wealth it's very dangerous if most of it ends up in the hands of a very few people and they fail to redistribute it back into the pot. They just become like the state in a communist system, corrupt, bloated and all powerful.

Amazon, Apple and the like are not particularly capitalist success stories they are in fact a glitch because their sheer size is a threat to the system.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 10:04

For all its faults Capitalism is the best system there is, the alternatives, socialism and communism simply do not work, even the Communist Chinese now have a capitalist economy

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 10:13

The real dangers if the acceleration of inequality continues is mass economic migration which no amount of Brexity nonsense will stop, social unrest, social breakdown and in extreme circumstances civil war not being confined to third world countries but spreading through Europe and the US.

The more those that have try to cling on to what they have the less those that have not.... have to lose.

To start with governments will think that the answer is to become more right wing and crack down harder and harder, Daily Mail readers will demand it but once the prisons fill up and the hungry people keep coming they'll start to realise that they're feeding the problem when they should be feeding the people.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 12:08

The good thing now is you have the choice to get off your ass and make something how much that’s up to you but what’s on it’s way if the sheep don’t wake up and put are differences aside is no choice it’s already started but we can get through this but the sheep need to wake up and think for yourself The 1% think for themselves the 99% don’t simple as that

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 12:22

It's very arrogant and usually way off the mark to think that you know the right answers and everyone else are "sheep".

There are no real rules to living, rules are only a constructed framework that the majority of us choose to follow.

You're no less of a sheep for choosing to put clothes on this morning, becoming an "activist" or posting a comment on here. Those are all artificially constructed rules just the same.

Sheep follow each other around because they know that if the flock is attacked by a wolf the sickest and weakest will die first. It's actually a very individualist mindset.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 15:22

sindba wrote:Hate these rich people lording it over us, taking us out the EU to boost their hedge funds, trying to privatise the NHS, and not paying their taxes.

But do like a cheeky MacD's.

Got to be a good balance there somewhere.

I don't think a no deal Brexit will boost any hedge fund unless they are seriously shorting British companies.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 15:47

barcajr wrote:For all its faults Capitalism is the best system there is, the alternatives, socialism and communism simply do not work, even the Communist Chinese now have a capitalist economy



Again, no they don't have anything like true Free Market Capitalism... they also have Corporatism just like all the other so called ''capitalist'' economies.

I do wish people would do a bit of reading up on just what Free Market Capitalism is before bandying around the word ''capitalism''

As far as I can see no large economy on the planet has a true Free Market Capitalist system in operation.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 15:54

barcajr wrote:For all its faults Capitalism is the best system there is, the alternatives, socialism and communism simply do not work, even the Communist Chinese now have a capitalist economy



The system (incorrectly) referred to as ''Capitalism'' failed and collapsed in 2008, every bit as much as Communism failed and collapsed in 1989.

If the commies had sent in the tanks in 1989 they could have kept a failed and bankrupt sham of a system struggling on for a few more years or decades... the so called ''Capitalist'' economies did the economic equivalent of ''sending in the tanks'' in 2008 to keep their own failed and bankrupt sham of an economic system propped up and struggling on for a few more years.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 16:48

Everyone hates socialism until they are furloughed

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 18:24

Yes. Its working as intended for those at the top via crony capitalism transforming us into a plutocracy, while the rest of us descend into living in a materialistic, decadent and debt ridden consumerist economic zone.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

13 Sep 2020, 23:41

There's the saying: we can sooner imagine the end of the world than the end of Capitalism.

Due to the relatively brief lifetime of a person it may seem eternal (disregarding the experiment that ended in 1991), stretching as far back as collective memory allows and conceivably deep into the future. It's only been around since the last economic system stopped fulfilling the needs of enough people to precipitate radical change.

It's so hard to think beyond the current system of material relations when you're fully immersed in it because usually that system is unnamed. When the system encompasses everything, why name it? Does the universe need a name? 'Feudalism' wasn't coined until long after it disappeared from Western Europe. One day you're growing turnips for the lord of the manor, the next he's been guillotined and you have to clock into the factory. It's eternal... until the next Black Swan.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

14 Sep 2020, 08:48

Labels, everything needs dissecting and labelling it seems, normally done by those who are an irrelevance to everyday life. It's "Corporatism" no it's Neo-Capitalism" no it's Capitalism" blah blah blah.
The way things are, for every family of four living in a scummy flat on meagre benefits or some poor sod sleeping in a doorway who'll be used as an example of the old "see? Capitalism doesn't work" there's probably a few hundred (at least) families living in nice housing (possibly council but usually home-owned), driving a car and owning other consumer durables, enough food to eat and with health care that most in the world can only dream off.
Things would change if the whole of Birmingham was ablaze under food riots, but until that apocalyptic time, those much maligned "sheep" are happy enough.
It's not perfect but it easily beats any other system that's been tried to date, however some may choose to label it.

Does Capitalism suck the life out of the nation?

14 Sep 2020, 10:35

The challenge to capitalism is keeping enough headroom between what the bottom rung of the ladder can earn through working and what they would receive if they didn't because without the financial motivation to work in a dingy factory why would you?

There's two ways to do that obviously, higher wages and a decent benefits system or lower wages and next to no support.

Some countries like Germany, Sweden,Japan, Norway etc prefer the first while others like the US prefer the second option, I would put us somewhere in the middle with a hybrid system using government money (tax credits) to artificially create higher wages but we are definitely sliding more towards the US system.

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